Offensive Symbols in KAG --> Offensive Symbols in General --> General Chat on Religion

Look, Luigi and Bone have made some very good arguments, all you have done, Sly, is gone "NO, IT OFFENDS ME, MUS BE REMOVED"

 

"I won't stand for anyone making fun of my beliefs"

Spoiler

It's the price you pay for having beliefs at all. If it--or you--can't stand criticism, you should rethink things.
</br>--- merged: Apr 2, 2013 1:32 AM ---</br>
And like I said before, it really must be left up to the server owner's discretion as to what's appropriate on a server. Everyone is free to choose a server where they won't be offended, or host one themselves.

 

I stopped paying attention to this thread after it went of track, and i'm going to try and have a little update thing for ppl like me.

Nazi symbol:
Offensive to Germans as Hitler gave the country a bad name. He did bring them out of the depression with determination and making a common enemy which they (the community) rose up against, the jews. But as we all know Hitler went crazy, maybe for power or glory but killing jews was not the right step to take.

Jews (not all jews) are offended by this symbol as they lost a lot of history with the killing of their ancestors. Their elders (family), and thus the new generation of jews are most likely telling how cruel and sadistic the nazies were by their parents, comparing the symbol to hell. Which i'm assuming will have the same affect on a jew as if one would disregard your religion.

Swastika symbol:
Ancient symbol mostly known for Hinduism, Buddism, etc (Indian cultures). Anyway, the argument is that the symbol shouldint be disregarded because it has much greater meaning which triumphs the nazi symbol. And they are pretty much different symbols meaning different things with different history.

Religion:
For some reason people are viewing all the religions as one.
And for some reason think that the bible is the religion.
Firstly, the bible is just a guide. You should not pray towards it or think it will protect you, its a book -.-"
However that comment goes against the Catholics as they pray to statues.
Point is, all religions are vastly different, should not make it a general argument.

And then their are people who doesint give a shit and have the strongest argument that the owner of the server has the right to decide. But then there's weirdos saying that kag will become a nazi game or some shit.

Slystawker, to my knowledge (did'nt read every comment)
Is defending the Jews who take offence to the symbol or some shit.
And blueluigi says they should nut up as it did not affect them personally, which i think is the way to go, but is with out a doubt the less responsible way.

Thats the arguments that i've read :L.

Personally i think people should not take the game this seriously. Its a bloody game.

 

Seriously, when my grandmother sees people quoting bullshit that goes against her beliefs, she just laughs. Why? Because according to her beliefs, she's going to heaven. Why should she care what anyone else thinks?

If this is your view on debate, I suggest you grow a pair and come back in a few months.

 

OK, this thread IS going off-topic, but:
1. BL, I never said that anybody else's opinion was wrong because I was offended or disagreed with it. That's really passive thinking. No-one achieves anything with passive, close-minded thinking.

2. 'My kind'? Do you think I'm trying to dictate the opinions of all? No. My kind is the kind that likes to think, and argue for what he believes is right. Your 'kind', likes steamrolling people and branding them as idiots because you don't agree with them, which makes you a hypocrite (because of my first point). So, what else are you?

3. 'If you recall FBB was totally on your side and I had to actually do a lot of typing in order to not also get reported for said thing, all because you made some utterly retarded comment.' Well, good. What kind of 'retard' makes a thread solely to flame another member of the forum? Answer: Apparently its BL.

4. '...Once again as always I don't care about what side you are on I care that you are clearly under the age of 13 and allowed to use forums, there is a reason that almost every forum in existence has a rule of no one under the age of 13 (infact there is a US law against it)...' American rules don't apply in Australia, if you didn't know. Also, how would you know that I am under the age of 13? You have no proof, so why ramble on about something you don't know? Anyway, I've seen 8 year olds who could articulate better than you. Cut down on the rage and add a bit more brain into your posts.

5. '...the same way I can call you a fuckwit a few times before it actually becomes harassment and ban worthy....' Just try it. You're not going to achieve anything, and insult is the weapon of the cowardly.

6. 'I'm just gonna put you on ignore and wait to see how long it takes for me to passively notice where you left a comment in another one of these types of threads.' On the other hand, I have no wish to see you shit all over the thread again.

 

Locking this thread before either of you regret what you post.

Chill down boys. Both of you have good points, but to be honest, this convo is heated. Let's all come back to it in 3 months, okay?

 

I'm just being realistic. I appreesh reopening the thread and I guess I'll be a little more conscientious from here on out... I'm just saying, on a forum that's less strictly moderated, Sly would be pummeled into the ground so badly his grandkids would still be crying 50 years from now.

The big issue here (aside from everyone getting a little defensive and/or aggressive) is that while some of us are being subjective, others aren't willing to see things from all sides.

I often forget that not everyone had seen my C&E intro paragraph, so I'd like to make it clear. I'm not like everyone else here, I was raised in a very VERY strict Christian upbringing. My grandmother is the queen of shoving her beliefs down other people's throats, going as far as pulling a homosexual friend of mine aside to tell him that if he didn't change his "evil ways" he would go to Hell. Over the years I broke free of their beliefs and began to think for myself.

Agnosticism varies greatly from atheism. Atheism implies that there is nothing greater than us, that we are our own masters. Agnosticism implies that there IS a power greater than ourselves, but we're unsure of what it is, and we disagree with all other forms of religion. It's important to remember that when I say I am free thinking, it only implies that I don't feel a great need within myself to refer to a book or pray to someone/something I do not believe exists. That's the difference between Sly and myself. I have no issue with those of you who hold belief in religion, I just happen to disagree.

 

Meh, my view is that 'I'm to small and stupid to understand more then 2% of the world around me' So therefore I have no fucking idea if there is a power, or if there isn't. And frankly I don't care either way. If I die and I go to some swag-ass place that's great, otherwise big woop I'm dead. Although I do find these types of arguments incredibly amusing.

 

swatiska is good because diagonal blocks dont exist in kag
What i mean is that the nazi form of swariska is on a diagonal while people build it on its side making it not really a nazi symbol.

 

Jesus fuck, all the reading.

Anywho; A couple of notes:

I agree that it's completely up to the server owner(s). I'll have my opinions and judge the server owner(s), of course, but I can't question their authority, it's their server.

As for judging religion as one thing, I'm talking about this in a very philosophical way. That means I'm taking broad things and placing social rules for them, that just represent general trends, not facts. Religion is actually pretty applicable with broader things though, because by definition, it relies on faith, which is basically all I'm talking about. Faith, by definition, is dogmatic, and is irrational. It is believing in something lacking any evidence, despite there possibly being much more reasonable conclusions, which faith tells you to shut out no matter what. It is literally blind, pretty undeniably. Know, I understand people think that's okay, and that's totally fine by me, I don't care, but you need to realize that religion is blind, by nature. I myself am not really arguing about the specifics of individual religions, but the trends of religions, and their necessities, and how I personally don't think they apply well nowadays. I challenge anyone to give me a religion that does not require faith.

As for atheists vs. agnostics, I'm relatively surprised how little actual atheists I know. I consider myself an atheist, I think the idea of a "greater power" is a biological impulse we put upon ourselves in order to explain things we don't understand, and I don't think there is any rules or purpose in anything. Everything is simply cause and effect, I just do what I do to please my own biological and psychological impulses and wants because it makes me feel good, because hey, I like feeling good.

I personally don't quite find the Crusades or the Inquisition to be on the same level as the Holocaust, but I completely understand how both a swastika and a cross can be offensive. I also think it's silly to censor a swastika if no one cares, or JUST because it's a swastika. If someone is being all "death to the jews!" or is being a bitch to someone who admits that they're offended, then yeah, that's not cool.

As for the bible, it's just a book. I don't care how you view it, it's a goddamn book. Please don't act like a book trumps federal or state law, or basic human rights, it fucking doesn't. Most people aren't like that, but after reading arguments defending Defense of Marriage Act on Debate.org, let's just say I'm a tad disappointed. It's like people didn't pay attention to US history in school and missed the whole 'separation of church and state' part. If you think it's a guide, sure, whatever, I think you're weird, but what do I matter? If you can't tell, I dislike most of the book's teachings. I've actually read the bible in multiple different forms, my grandma sent a version to me half the birthdays of my childhood life (she's still trying to save me in her 90s). All new testament, by the way.

 

I agree on the point where people who build swastikas for nothing should be branded as griefers. After all, if you wanted to build that, you should've gone to a creative server or something. Otherwise, you help the team. That's why I get annoyed at people locking themselves in stone boxes for no reason.

 

The same goes for building crosses everywhere.

 

We must go deeper...

Edit

While it is true that agnostics seem to be sitting on the fringe of nihilism, I would have to disagree. Just because I don't know if someone is looking at me through a mall security camera or not doesn't mean I can't make a significant purchasing decision.