The Problem

If you have two walls facing off against each other, pretty much at any one time you are either going to have soldiers from the left attacking the right wall or soldiers from the right attacking the left wall. My point is that if one side is better, it will have the other side on the defensive most of the time. If you are constantly on the defence it is because you are losing which is turn is because you are worse (or doing worse at that period of time), would you not agree to that? However my point is also that it is very hard to break through the defense if the defenders are competant, despite the attacking team being better (or playing better at that time).

I suppose what I am trying to say is: Attacking is too hard, defending is too easy, this should be rectified.

 

So you want to nerf the game not because you feel that it's unbalanced but because players who defend or attack are "competent". I have a feeling you really do want to dumb down the attacking side. Like I've mentioned many times, nerfs are the reason that a game gets derailed by adding more cracks onto a broken wall. Instead of widening those cracks, Kag developers should patch it up with cement, in other words, ADD to the attacking side instead of sanding down the defensive side which will conflict with future updates.

 

No he basically wants to make it so games end quicker. The attacking side usually wins anyway through unit count it's just they can never take down the massive castle the defenders have built before the unit count is up. It may as well not be CTF because by the time you get the flag all the units are dead anyway. It's stupidly hard to attack a large base with a bunch of archers sitting on the top firing arrows down and it shouldn't be THAT hard.

 

I would

I would agree with this sentiment, However from my experiences it is the defending side that wins by unit count, as the attackers throw themselves in vain against the defenses over and over to no real effect

 

Which is a reason why Kag devs are adding siege towers and portable workshops which will definitely help the attacking side A LOT.

 

As I said earlier, the people who defend do not have to be that competant, and it really does not matter how competant the attackers are it rarely makes a difference to thier failure

 

I'm just saying though, once those updates come out, balancing will be and even bigger issue if we make changes now.

 

However this will do more for the game in my opinion honestly. I would much rather be dropping rocks and oil or something on the attacking force than just repairing up everything they do, that's just boring.
Secondly, a high enough tower will render a siege tower useless, and portable workshops will not add that much - you can build a workshop in a tower near the defence
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I really do not think that nerfing repairing now will make such a huge problem, it can always be modified back if needed and will make the current game a lot more enjoyable

 

Based on being a tester, the defending side are going to get at least one new cool thing which may or may not make it imba or whatever. Also I don't know if this thing is premium only yet but you use it in zombie mode so it might well be.

 

Goddamit, stop making me jealous

 

Again, it seems that you detest the building aspect in the game, I'd go find a medieval siege game that only allows pre-built structures.

You also make editing game files seem like a pair of clothes that can be changed. No, it's more complicated than you think. Different content will encourage more strategies which seem to make people like you feel a sense of unbalance, and if we change things now and get hit hard by a siege equipment update, we're only putting more weight digging for the pros and cons compared to the facts we already know from what we have now.

 

Let's not argue about boiling oil and dropping rocks because 1. i'm sure boiling oil will make it in sometime (fire is coming so why shouldn't it) and 2. dropping rocks is essentially already possible but a rock dropper IS planned.

 

You assume a lot
Firstly that I hate building, I do not, builder is by far my favorite class, but I have the wisdom to realise it is very overpowered as it is (It will always be overpowered, but you can lessen this).
Secondly, I am no programmer but I would think programming what seems to me like a simple change in mechanics is less complicated then adding a completely new mechanic or two from scratch. Anyone veiwing this who is a programmer by trade feel free to correct me.
More strategies is a good thing, I have never said it was not, but currently the ONLY stratagy worth a damn really is build a good tower and turtle all game, I would like to see that change.
Lastly, there is no proof that the siege weapons coming out will solve anything, however a solution needs to be found really and quickly, zombies isnt even out, how long until we finally get siege equipment?

What your saying is we should just let the game remain broken until siege equipment comes along and HOPE that fixes the problem.

 

Seriously Quiles, you want a game where it's simple to take down enemy walls with catapults? Go play Crush The Castle or some other flash game that was designed that way. Quit trying to ruin the game for me.

Even speaking from the shoes of an OFFENSIVE builder, I run in and build a decent, defense frontline structure. Suddenly the opposition is coming back, and oops! Can't repair that either! Building a team friendly wall to storm the enemy castle and they happen to have a builder chipping away at the base? OH WELL! Can't build off of it or repair it!

Your logic and reasoning behind this are ridiculous. Everything you have been saying would hinder both teams, defensive or attacking. In Last Stand situations, the ability to repair and extend upon broken/damaged structures are key to turning the tides and sending the offense running. In offensive situations, frontline towers/walls/ANYTHING that take a few hits from any source and happen to have a builder (again) encased in stone and chipping away at the base, are (again) fucked.

You are viewing this solely from the defensive side of things, you're STILL not thinking in terms of BALANCE. Your ideas do nothing aside from ruin the advantages of builders, either defensive OR offensive.

And you know how you combat a "turtle" repairing a single tower? Build a fucking ladder on the front of it and send some knights over to slaughter him.

OH MY GOD THAT BUILDER IS INDESTRUCT-

oh wait.

 

man i feel sorry for any devs who read this thread.

 

Nah, I just like games where its POSSIBLE to take down a wall with catapults
You really just don't like the idea that you might have to lose your precious structure at some point

If the frontline structure you built is decent, it will be able to hold up under a little pressure surely?

If your just watching a builder chip at your tower why the hell are you watching? Your knights can just stab him, honestly, you complain about adaption.

You claim everything I have been saying would hinder both teams, in what way may I ask?

In terms of last stand in my experience and every game I have ever watched end whoever attacks loses, thats how it works, I see something wrong here.

Once again you state how I will "ruin" builders, care to share how?
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Meh, I wouldnt agree, we are actually argueing sensibly and not screaming at each other (yet)

 

Well, they did say they were interested in what we want of the future.

Basically, I want the same game, just with more ways to destroy structures (which are coming), more ways to deal with griefing (F2P and full memberships), and maybe, just MAYBE a longer charge time for archers to be able to shoot the minimum shots to cut down on arrow spam.

10 seconds to place a block? Lunacy. Unable to repair a tower that's under attack? Retarded. No stone underground? Idiocy.

I mean, I've only been playing for a month, but I've familiarized myself with enough of the game, the community, and the mechanics of each class to know that most things introduced sprout simply from people's anger that it's not easier for their favorite class to do more.

Okay, it's fairly obvious you HAVEN'T been playing for 3 months because these things would be obvious to you.

It IS easy to take down a wall with catapults. Put it in a decent spot set up with archers to take out the builders and you don't have a problem.

I don't care if my "precious structure" goes down. My point is I'm not gonna let it down just because a builder gets down there quick enough to encase himself in stone and takes it down with little to no effort. Knights can't destroy stone, remember? How are they supposed to stab a builder through a stone bubble?

A frontline tower that can take abuse, eh? Okay, refer to the "builder in the stone bubble" thing again. Then what? It goes down with no effort whatsoever.

I've described more than enough ways how it would be harmful to both teams. You just fail to read and understand that I'm not the builder hiding in the bottom corner of a building, doing nothing but mining resources and repairing it as soon as they get to it.

I'm the builder trying to press forward and build structures that can be effectively held and repaired, even if under siege. But if it's constantly under siege, being just outside the enemy castle, then what? Any building can take a ton of abuse, but for how long? If I'm not able to make simple repairs to the important points because a builder closes himself in with stone next to the structure, what am I supposed to do then?

You're not thinking of both sides. You're thinking of the attacking side. You want the game to be easier. You want to remove the skill aspect of the game because HEAVEN FORBID a builder make something that you can't blast your way through.

Seriously, wanna take these guys out? Have a few knights protect you as you ladder up the front wall and bust through the doors. Problem fucking solved. Quit whining about how it's SOOOO HARD to bring down towers... THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE HARD TO TAKE DOWN. How about adapting and instead of trying to go THROUGH them, go OVER or UNDER? Why is this concept so fucking hard to understand? No, instead let's take away one of the builder's few abilities to repair a tower so it's easier for you to win.

Give me a fucking break.

 

Once again I bring up the point I abandoned the no stone underground point LONG ago, your not really listening.
Its not actually as easy as you think to take down a tower with a catapult, not sure who you are playing with/against. One catapult takes several shots to destroy a stone block, during which time it can be repaired. I give you this does present the limited resources problem, but since the catapult takes 10 stone per shot and repairing 5 per stone, the catapult usually runs out first. Catapults can also be destroyed by archers before doing much real damage if the enemy archers know what they are doing.
Second of all, if the builder encases himself in stone you can just dig him out again - he cannot keep placing walls due to the no placing while under attack rule, and builders do that now anyway but to greater effect as they can just keep walling themselves in as neccesary as they dig through the tower.

 

That rule doesn't take effect for the enemy builder as it's not THEIR tower. Even then, all they have to do is stagger-stone their way down as knights try to dig under.

Like so.










So, then what? Again, you're not thinking strategy so much as, "I WANNA WIN :(:("

 

Ahem, ahem, now I'm sorry if I post something unrelated to the discussion because honestly, I can't catch up with you two.

But Quile wants to be able to easily bring down enemy castles with catapults - sure, just have three of them constantly firing!

MIINDBLOOOOWWN

A structure that has much effort and skill put to it, eh, shouldn't really be able to get teared down by only one catapult which is under attack.
Once again, kegs alone will change a lot, let's wait for them. Free version will be surely balanced too, but I am just feeling so sorry for poor Geti who has to read all of this :P