Class Bawww/Argument thread

It's really annoying trying to chase people running away, so I was thinking it would be cool if you moved faster when moving in the direction you're facing and slightly slower when running backwards. It would also cut down on the whole "walking 2 miles backwards" thing.

edit: disregard this suggestion, keep reading to get to the part where people (including me) cry about which class is op.

 

It's funny because when walking backwards it uses the sprites for walking forwards to it looks like you're moon walking. :P

 

il just put this here...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eN2gI-Qxj7c

 

It'd help make archers less of a headache. I hate running after an archer going the same speed as me spamming the fuck out of his arrows in my face.

 

It would encourage more camping and less charging, even though it sounds reasonable.

 

I don't think it would discourage charging. If it's mild, just mild enough so knights can catch up to arrow spammers, and so archers or knights can't just high-tail it out of there, then people will still charge blindly into combat anyway (I've seen so many knights run into arrow rain without a seconds doubt and die almost immediately, then do it again once they respawn). In fact, it might encourage knights to charge more, since it's more rewarding to run after a cocky player. It might encourage some archers to camp in a tower more, but hopefully someone will come up with a way to counter that sooner then later.

 

If people want to run away, they'd just face the right way. I don't see how it's going to stop runners, apart from people that like to shoot while running ( Don't those already get a speed penalty? )

The only effect I can think of is that you'll be able to see less while running away

 

This would only realistically help Knights. It really only promotes more camping for archer because no there's less of a chance to get away on the battlefield. I think the idea sounds good, but in my personal opinion (not that it matters to you).
Knights can already hack through everything except stone and gold blocks, they can glide (1 block on the field can boost them up and make them catch up to you), can throw bombs that can crumble everything including bedrock, shield from other bombs, bomb-jump, shield bash, give archers cover, provide jumping platforms, sword jump, and have a charge power attack.

I mean I like the knight class but i think this would only add to the problem of (what I believe) is an already OP class.

I guess in the rare case of a knight having lower health than a builder and the builder chasing after him, it makes sense to me, but in all other senses, it just seems like a weakness to the builder and archer class.

 

Realistically I don't think this would be a huge change but I think it would have an impact. Mainly I was thinking about knight vs knight combat in RDM. Often times the end game is one player chasing another player but often unable to reach him for a long period of time since the coward fires off jabs as he's running backwards, meaning that the chaser can't occupy the space directly behind the coward as that would mean taking damage.

 

While running away you could change direction for a split second during a jab thus negating the purpose of this. Only noobs would get more easily killed.

 

Night_Horde, I respect your opinion, but I think you're in the minority of thinking knights are an OP class. Although I said it in a joking manner, it is an honest balance problem that archers beat knights at any distance that isn't stabbing distance. It's like how easily archers can swing to tree from tree can be a problem, because they can just spam arrows, making it impossible for the knight unless he/she had the 20 gold to spend on a bomb, and he/she had the bomb on him/her, and managed to time it correctly. That's a lot harder the tapping left and right arrows and mashing your right-click. It's okay if an archer can get away from a knight, but not okay if they can run away at the same speed and still fire arrows. It's currently impossible for a good knight to catch and kill a good archer without bombs or sneaking up on them, which is a rarity.

 

Hilarious.

Knights are already slowed down when shielding.

You want to further slow them down when they run away from multiple archers?

Insane.


Almost as insane as giving knights the ability to reflect arrows with their shields.

 

reflecting arrows with a sword slash would be pretty pimp though.

 

I'm kinda against this unless only Knights have to deal with it. Knights are already the most mobile class in the game (which really shouldn't be the case, I mean they're wearing bloody ass metal shoulder pads and large shield), if you jump down as an archer in an attempt to run away they already glide right on your head, no escape. If this feature would be added to archers, it would only promote camping which ends up with draws when an archers just sits on an unreachable cliff and spams arrows while the knights can't do crap. Trust me, as an archer I rather run around and get opportunity shots then sit in one place and just spam arrows, it sucks and it's boring for everyone.

Also... bombs anyone? The most sure way to kill an archer is to run towards them and use bombs. They die every time but most people don't realize this and simply throw them blindly hoping for a kill against other knights that can shield. Dumbass move by the way, ~unless~ you know you're an excellent bomb thrower that can make use of it vs a shielding knight, in which case I applaud your skills, otherwise, keep it for the archer would be my advice.

I'd also have to agree with Night_Horde on this one. Knights are fucking OP. The only time I win vs knights is against newbies or decent players (or when I have an archer buddy and we gang up on him), against skilled ones that actually make use of their bombs and mobility, they simply move towards me, shielding when needed (which is most of the time unless I don't have line of sight), until either one of us makes a mistake or he gets close enough to throw a bomb. And most cases I simply can't do anything unless they do one big mistake, they just shield constantly. There are also way to simply jump and shield to catch up to an archer, takes a bit of timing but it can happen. It's not really hard to spot an archer readying to shoot when you have him in front of you.

Knights are already OP, they got all the tools they need to win against archers 1vs1 but most knights don't seem to realize this as they charge head long, not paying attention to the battlefield or to the fact that the enemy team has archers. Reason why most knights die to archers is because of their own fault for not paying attention and playing smart. Also the climbing up a tree and arrow spamming? Only works if the knight charges left and right instead of shielding and waiting for the right moment the archer jumps to the next tree. As long as the knight shields and takes his time the archer can't do jack shit and it only takes one small stab to end it all.

Also... just because the majority think that archers are OP doesn't mean it's correct or a fact, especially coming from players who play a class who can shield ALL attacks, are the most mobile, have 3 hearts and bombs which can instant kill anything it touches. And which most simply dislike archers cuz they might not know how to deal with them or simply say it out of spite for getting shot by them while taking on 2-3 other knights. Yeah... that would definitaly hurt a knight's pride, maybe even hold a big grudge against the class that embarrassed him. :p

But I'm waaay of topic now.. my vote would be a big ~NO~ for this one, even if realistically it's sound it would screw up game balance. :p

 

I get you and I respect you opinion too but you can't disagree that they are the most versatile class in the game. The archer can climb trees, recover arrows, shoot, and climb on arrows. And that's basically it. The knight just has so many skills at his disposal.

I guess I'm just getting tired of the constant "no man's land" where bombs blow up every 5 seconds. I like to consider myself a field builder and it just becomes pointless to try and take land when if you don't die from the first bomb, the second one is about to go off 3 blocks away. 20 coins for a bomb is chump change. Even if you suck as a knight and are rushing headstrong into death, you just change to builder and chop a tree for 8 seconds and, whala new bomb.

The shield gliding can bridge most space between you and an enemy and the bombs radius is absolutely absurd. Don't get me wrong I love when i drop a bomb at the correct time and take out three people, but even I can see there something wrong with this. And the knight is the only one who can instantly shield from the blast. I don't blame archer's for staying in their towers. It's not very hard to time a bomb and throw it in someone's general direction, and with that blast radius, it's like sending an archer to the beaches of Normandy on D-day. Builder can try and cover themselves, but you better be one quick-ass builder. No to mention why would I risk my hundreds of coins to go out and get gibbeled by some lucky ass throw. But I'm getting off topic.

If anything I think this should only apply to knights, who are running around in full plate mail. Why should they run faster than a builder? And archer's really aren't a problem unless they're in groups. If you're running after them in the trees then that's you own fault. Put up your shield and wait for backup. You can't rambo everything.

If anything I'd rather see more skills for the archer, and possibly builder (but they'll be getting ropes and slopes soon.)

 

It's funny isn't it. All the people who play Knight think that the Archer is OP and all the people that play Archer think the Knight is OP.

 

So true Khan. I do think that archers are op. :D
On-topic though: I think this is a good idea, I've died (wouldn't say many) some times to an archer because he can run backwards and spam arrows all over me. If there wouldn't be backpedaling, there atleast should be thing that stops archers from spamming arrows, when running backwards. Cooldown or something.

 

I once dared to venture into one of the more esoteric servers in KAG, where an archer admin made his twisted vision of crippled/slowed 2 heart knights who couldn't even use bombs and archers with 4 hearts who could spam arrows as fast as they could click their mouses into a reality. Naturally, a fully charged arrow did 2 hearts worth of damage.

But this was not enough to satisfy the demon archer admin.

He created an archer bot that mimicked his actions, essentially making any knight's shield worthless against an attack.

I never found that anti-knight hell server ever again.

I pray no one ever does.

 

Rushing might become overpowered on servers that have small build times.
And I can't imagine how the combat would change because of how fast the enemy is when your running away, slashing would become useless. Also I do not like the idea that you would slow down just because your facing the wrong direction, what happens if your jumping over a knight to attack his/her backside but you slow down because your facing the wrong way and then get jab spammed.

Archers would become more aggressive at the beginning and more defensive at the end of games.
Trying to get through tree friction is hard enough too, and It would be even slower.

Off topic stuff: I like how you say the knight just has so many skills at his/her disposal, even though most of those skills are broken, glitchy and can be stopped quite easily.
Also you said armour right . . . . Knights don't have armour it's just their clothes look like it ^__^

Knights are masters at horizontal combat (except for when you archers have those stun arrows which are five times more powerful then a bash and can still stun from 40-50 blocks away) And archers are masters of vertical battles, I mean have you ever seen a entire army trying to climbing a ladder but can't because of one archer using full charged arrows.
Bombs used to be better you know, they had a huge range of one hit death, but the archers back in that build would avoid them easily because if they saw a bomb they would get the fuck out of there. Archers today think that it's okay to see a bomb and think it's not going to hit them because they are in a tree -___-

 

Wow people are taking this suggestion super mad seriously despite the fact that the devs will probably never ever see it. I am pleased.

@Raelian: That's funny because I was just about to make an uber post on how knights are an unnecessary and therefore underpowered class. I think you feel that they are so powerful and archers are so weak because knights have a number of fun and 'effective' (I use this term in a specific way) tools whereas when one plays archers its difficult to feel like you have any power or control as you have so few tools.

Massed charge shot spam + worker support beats everything except maybe certain tunneling situations.

Archer is factually an overpowered class insofar in that it is a primary contributor to a strategy which detracts from the overall variety and fun in the game. I completely agree that the archer is underFUN and can feel extremely impotent and I have made suggestions, many of which in conversation to the game developers, asking them to rectify this. However it is wrong to say that Knights are "fucking OP", when they are in reality the most underpowered class (though again, they have the largest quantity of and most interesting tools).