[590] Gather Tower

Hey guys, its been a while since I've posted a tower.

First of all I would like to thank kilatron46 for showing me the base structure of the tower and the archer cover/catapult area during Gather matches. The tower is based on the basic Gather tower, I've tested this on CTF servers and have made adjustments according to what happened to the tower. It's a low resource and highly effective tower.

Screenshots of the tower:

Spoiler: Tower on its own

Spoiler: Labelled Tower

Red: These are catapult areas. The lower one is only to be used if the orange area isn't there. The upper one is used when there is the orange area.
Orange: The top orange is a collapsible archer area, its elevated high up for increased effectiveness, to allow knights to throw bombs and archers to shoot out of reach of most bombs. It prevents archers from using the lower doors which are vulnerable to bombs. It also works to prevent archers from scaling the tower. Note: Its only to be collapsed under dire circumstances. Otherwise its not worth it. The lower orange bit works as stone dropping area (if the tree isn't there), scares and kills attacking knights.
Blue: Tree, makes laddering up harder for any would-be attackers.
Green: Convenient shops. Least important on the bottom, most important on the top. It may not be as convenient, but it helps if the enemy do breach the tower, because they cant reach those bombs as easily. Bombs can do the most damage to the tower and the team. The red catapult area above it also serves to protect the shops from arrows.
Purple: Prevents any knights from getting up.
Pink: Lets the team up.

Video on how to build it:

Spoiler: Video

Added some music: Radioactive by Imagine Dragons
And I fast forwarded it so its quicker.

Please critique.

Thanks,
Force

 

A bit resource heavy, taking a while to build (definitely more than the standard gather building phase time), but otherwise OK. There should be ladders on the workshop isle, because it's otherwise a bit difficult to get up to the actual workshops. This is a good tower, although a bit expensive, in my own view.

 

There should not be ladders on the workshop isles, as it is supposed to be hard for enemy knights to reach the bomb workshop. This is a preemptive measure against enemy knights.

The orange door at the bottom is blocked by the tree, therefore a collapse is unable to be performed unless the tree is chopped to below that certain height.

A collapse would most appropriately be prepared just above the first door way, spanning 2-4 blocks across.

The entry point, 3 trap bridges although solves the problem of enemy knights getting up, as well as blocking ladders from being placed there, still presents a problem to team players.
Firstly, the act of moving up trap bridges, whereby your back block (players have 2 blocks which they stand on, the front block, which they are standing on and facing, and the back block, which they are standing on but not facing, this concept is very complicated to grasp, so...) is used to move up the tower. This is very slow accent, and enemy chasers may very well beat you up as you jump for it (or they deactivate the bridges causing you to fall down).

Players should also be given more platform length by which they can lob bombs or shoot arrows (door flashing) through without worry about the opponent shooting an arrow or throwing a bomb inside (the act of being able to aim accurately at enemies with bombs or arrows, without exposing yourself for too long).
You wouldn't want someone holding the door open for too long would you?

The top orange archer-cata-collapsible is certainly smart in that it takes the spreading of blocks into account (where many blocks lined vertically will spread across the ground and air after it has been collapsed, causing damage to multiple tiles not just directly underneath it).

However a better recommendation would be simply of a medium-long horizontal platform which can be collapsed and rebuilt within optimum time (knights can't bomb it and builders with ladders can't reach it in time, or just collapse it before the bomb explodes the platform).

There is only 1 okay archer elevation. Here, it depends on archers being able to constantly readjust their aim when trying to door flash. The solution to this would be to simply make a small platform for them, whether it be stone, trap bridges or cheap ladders. It can also provide a good station for bomb slashing (out of the door).

All towers can be improved on, do not fret, it is through constructive criticism and revision that a tower becomes better.

 

Have you ever even played gather Kovett?

 

There's alot of ways to improve on this tower,
but this certainly isn't one. -_-

Have a like for you tower, and may the force be with you.

 

Eh, Kovett due to the length of your post I'm afraid I won't be able to quote it.

@Kovett: The tree in front of the tower does prevent collapses but also prevents enemy builder from laddering/bridging up the tower. If you spam bridges along the ground when you have a tree in front of your tower, it makes it nearly impossible to rush your tower.

 

Thanks for the critique.

In terms of the bottom orange collapsible area, I should have stated that the tree must be removed in order for it to work.
I like the trapbridges because it can be destroyed very easily, and repaired very easily.
I was also thinking about adding a platform inside to increase the surface area. The top catapult area certainly is a suitable position if knights want to bomb, because it is high up and can kill any rushing enemies before they even reach the tower. Also most bombs cant reach the top orange part.
In terms of the top collapsible, its designed to repel bomb jumpers and increase the height of the tower, and when I have used this ingame the bomb jumpers have hit the top orange part. So thus if I made a horizontal platform like you suggested, the result would inadvertently result in knights bomb jumping and breaching the top of the tower, which of course is not preferable. Also it is designed to repel builders scaling up the tower with ladders, enemies storming the tower. Because they would be in the collapse range and would die. The trap bridges also serve to scatter the stone. Increasing the area in which it hits.

 

If your a archer and your being chased behind knights your fucked... becuase the tree would slow you down so wouldn't get to the nearest entrance. The knights would have already cut the tree and killed you by then.

 

Your being very pessimistic. Most of the time that wouldn't happen. The knight wouldn't be able to cut the tree that quickly, your ascent would be too fast.

 

You know once, it was like that, the knight cut the tree and I fell down, but the fortunate thing was that as I fell down, I stomped him to death and then climbed back up slowly :D.

 

What do you recommend I do.

 

noo, noo, don't thank him.
It was all bullshit.

There should not be ladders on the workshop isles, as it is supposed to be hard for enemy knights to reach the bomb workshop. This is a preemptive measure against enemy knights.
But if the tower does what its' supposed to do, that can't be a problem.

The orange door at the bottom is blocked by the tree, therefore a collapse is unable to be performed unless the tree is chopped to below that certain height.
Sigh. The spikes perfectly prevent that from happening.

A collapse would most appropriately be prepared just above the first door way, spanning 2-4 blocks across.
This one is not made to be collapsed, it's just possible.

The entry point, 3 trap bridges although solves the problem of enemy knights getting up, as well as blocking ladders from being placed there, still presents a problem to team players.
Firstly, the act of moving up trap bridges, whereby your back block (players have 2 blocks which they stand on, the front block, which they are standing on and facing, and the back block, which they are standing on but not facing, this concept is very complicated to grasp, so...) is used to move up the tower. This is very slow accent, and enemy chasers may very well beat you up as you jump for it (or they deactivate the bridges causing you to fall down).
Please tell me you know how vaulting works? :p

Players should also be given more platform length by which they can lob bombs or shoot arrows (door flashing) through without worry about the opponent shooting an arrow or throwing a bomb inside (the act of being able to aim accurately at enemies with bombs or arrows, without exposing yourself for too long).
You wouldn't want someone holding the door open for too long would you?
The archer nest has doors with enough space to hide.
Just open the door, shoot, and hold "S".

The top orange archer-cata-collapsible is certainly smart in that it takes the spreading of blocks into account (where many blocks lined vertically will spread across the ground and air after it has been collapsed, causing damage to multiple tiles not just directly underneath it).
Nevermind this part, I agree.

However a better recommendation would be simply of a medium-long horizontal platform which can be collapsed and rebuilt within optimum time (knights can't bomb it and builders with ladders can't reach it in time, or just collapse it before the bomb explodes the platform).
Come on, it's supposed to be an archer nest. Collapsible is an extra, not a feature.

There is only 1 okay archer elevation. Here, it depends on archers being able to constantly readjust their aim when trying to door flash. The solution to this would be to simply make a small platform for them, whether it be stone, trap bridges or cheap ladders. It can also provide a good station for bomb slashing (out of the door).
Pfeh, I counted five, three of which were good for shooting.
1: The kneecapper at 5-6 blocks height is a tactical one, and used when the terrain is rough or uphill. It allows for some long-distance shots, while keeping the archer safe. Why uphill? Well, the arrow will travel paralel to the ground because of gravity.
2: The trapdoor (actually just a door) at the bottom of the archer nest is very good for stopping assaults by builders or small groups of knights. I admit that this one would work better with a ground-level kneecapper.
3: The two door-flashers are fine. I prefer the bottom one, because it is easier to quickly move away from your spot.
The top doorflasher and the entrance doors are not very good, but not bad either.

All towers can be improved on, do not fret, it is through constructive criticism and revision that a tower becomes better.
I "pfeh" you.
</br>--- merged: Jul 4, 2013 10:17 AM ---</br>

don't do anything: A smart archer will vault and touch the tree at the last moment.
A dumb archer is not worth saving anyways.

 

I don't want to start an argument, but being an experienced archer and builder, I disagree with some things you've said above. Firstly the door flashing is important for archery for known reasons, and its quite obvious in not only Gather, but also Clan Wars. When there are longer platforms, its much easier for team players to throw stuff out the door accurately, whether they be bombs or arrows.
Vaulting doesn't always work how you want it to be, if there's a knight right behind you, they'd be getting ready to slash you, and just that distance from vaulting off a block that is not pinpointed will not vault you up properly, and you'll end up doing the jump in which you jump from trapbridge to trapbridge (where trapbridges are 1 block apart in height), you just end up at the top of the bridges, since your trying to use your back tile to vault.

Sure you can say experienced players rarely have this problem, but it still happens. That's another reason the door is there for (other than collapsing).
A tower doesn't always do what it's supposed to do, that's the problem. You can't guarantee that a tower is impenetrable, no matter what, especially in Gather.

Also notice that there are 2 orange spots. The bottom orange spot is labelled as collapsing place, so you got that bit mixed up.

Although the collapse is an extra, I much rather keep that bit, since it's slightly heavier on resources, and since it's an archer nest as well, might as well just leave it like that.
You easily add a collapsible onto a door, sure, but it's sometimes quite hard during Gather, especially when the enemies right in front of you.

But the trapbridges that allow for the team to ascend will not serve a purpose to spread the collapse of the top, since if an enemy is underneath it, the bridges would certainly be deactivated. And of course, they would try to dodge and you can argue that the bridges activate again and spread the collapse, but you shouldn't depend on it.
The collapse is rather expensive, but in rare cases worth it. A good suggestion is to add an additional optional collapsible, such as what I have stated before.

However, Gofio has pointed out good points that I've forgot to mention or overlooked, such as bridges preventing enemy ladders. These can be placed in such areas such as underneath and on the side of an overhang, but I've yet to thoroughly investigate the effect to resource cost ratio.

You can certainly do door flashing by moving up and down the tower, but that sometimes causes you to have to readjust your aim, and also it's harder, and you have to actually lean against the building. If you don't time it perfectly right, you actually open multiple doors as there are many more entries and exits in this tower.

I don't come to the Builder Sub-Forums to argue, but only to help others, and make people aware of things that they weren't previously aware of.

 

The upper orange part was both designed as a archer spot and a collapsible, though the collapsible was designed only to be used in dire circumstances, such as enemies rushing with a builder. It mainly just to kill annoying builders.
The upper orange part will still collapse, even if the tree is touching it. Tree's don't affect collapses.
Generally I wouldn't recommend shooting from that spot, its very susceptible to bombs.

The lower orange part is mainly for an entrance, the collapsible is also a useful feature that I would use regularly.
If a builder is laddering up the tower, the cost for collapsing the upper orange part is definitely worth it. You can reduce the cost by removing the top doors and only having one set of double doors, but that makes the tower more susceptible to bomb jumpers and I find that the height is definitely worth the extra resources.
Of course in gather the upper orange bit usually wouldn't be built to save precious resources, but as I have said before, this tower isn't only restricted to Gather matches. I have tested this in many packed CTF servers and it has worked just as well.

To both of you:

Here are some changes I would make if I was making this in a Gather game:

• The shops would just have ladders beneath them.
• There would just be ladders to replace the alternating door and stone at the bottom of the tower.
• There would be only one layer of backwall near the wall.
• Usually no upper orange bit and upper red catapult spot, usually Gather maps are not very high and the upper orange bit isn't really necessary.
• The shop cover would still be there.
• And to replace the upper orange bit there would most likely be a short horizontal platform as Kovett suggested (only if the collapsible is really necessary)
• The bomb chute most likely wouldn't be there.
• And no random spike.
• Trap bridges to give archers more space when shooting from doors, and knights throwing bombs.

Spoiler: Visual Aid