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[203] Archer Discussion

Discussion in 'Archer' started by Wyeth, Nov 11, 2011.

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  1. Wyeth

    Wyeth KAG Guard Donator Tester

    Messages:
    375
    Changes build 200-203

    Please discuss the implications of this build for the Archer.
    I will update the Class Overview aswell with information from this thread.

    If you got something interesting enough to be worth its own thread, do not forget to put the current build number in front of the thread name. Thank you.
     
  2. Wyeth

    Wyeth KAG Guard Donator Tester

    Messages:
    375
    Nowadays I am trying out archer a bit more to get an overview of the classes.
    I often seem to find myself in a straight out stalemate with other archers. They sit in their towers I sit in mine and we try to snipe each other all day long. This is sorta lame I think, even though Carver said he likes that (on IRC).
    So its probably just my feeling, but I feel that archers have no way of going past a certain point on the map if other archers are present (very similar to builders) basically standing behind the covers and stalemating it out with the other archers was the only thing I could do... I felt sad.
    I was feeling that this problem can be solved by shortening archer range (as then we could more alongside the knights (or short behind them) instead of bunkering it out, but nerfing the archer even more is unthinkable right now, having very superior range is the only thing he has left, afterall. Just makes for pretty one dimensional gameplay compared to the other two.
     
  3. Skycow

    Skycow Shipwright

    Messages:
    9
    I don't like camping with an archer all that much, I lack the patience.

    What I tend to do is follow the charge of knights and stay behind them, so that when they get into combat with enemy knights and builders, I can fire on them while they are attacking.

    This way gets me quite a few kills, but there is a flaw to everything.

    Flaws like, if friendly knights die, your alone. You have to run, not much chance against a knight 1 on 1 as an archer. Bombs are your worst enemy, easily the majority of deaths are caused by bombs for this strategy. And of course the mediocre archers will snipe you if you get to close or to far away from the knights.

    This is just my strategy, I'm sure there are better ones, everyone is different, this is just what I find best for me instead of camping in a tower.
     
  4. NigerV2

    NigerV2 Shopkeep Stealer

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    100
    Give archers 2 bows:for snipers and for scouts.Than all be happy
     
  5. Zefree

    Zefree Shopkeep Stealer

    Messages:
    81
    Personally I think that archer is just a boring and very narrow class right now... It's my main class I play, but pretty much all games end up like a flash game where I just full-charged arrow snipe one handed.
    If I do anything different I frequently get blown up or stabbed by a knight. Sure the wall climbing ability is cool and fun at times, but if the only people who can climb walls are archers, then it's really just a way to get a different firing angle.

    Same thing different place.

    I guess my biggest irritation is seeing all the things a knight can do, and comparing them with the archer:

    -Knights WILL kill archers in melee, almost every time. Archers have no melee attack at all, and can't even break mine-able rocks or doors or ladders or platforms...
    -Knights get bombs, while archers have no "F" ability at all (I'm almost certain this is a temporary thing, but it is still frustrating). With a throw distance of maybe half the screen, the supposedly "melee" Knight becomes pretty formidable at range as well.
    -Knights get shields which allow-gliding, blocking, smashing, bomb-jumping, and "Knight Ladders".
    -Knights can't jump up "Arrow Ladders", but half the time I can't either lol! Supposedly the arrows last for 3 jumps, but I'm lucky if they survive me even touching them once. Not to mention the amount of shots wasted going up taller walls.
    -Knights can't climb trees, but they sure can knock your ass out of one. Which stuns you for about 3 weeks and almost always guarantees death.

    Pretty much every time I play the game, I feel like it is a game about Knights. A game about Knights where you rage at your Builder-slaves to make you a bomb shop and ladders. Oh yeah, and there are Archers too, but don't worry about them they are mostly for show and nobody cool plays them. They have to at least double your Knight numbers to even damage you, and you can jab them twice to kill them.

    I am not sure what I would like to see added, maybe some special arrow or attack that can compare in utility to the Knight's bomb.
     
    Contrary likes this.
  6. Shield-man

    Shield-man Shipwright

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    6
    oh yeah!
     
  7. Wyeth

    Wyeth KAG Guard Donator Tester

    Messages:
    375
    I agree with this.

    I do not think this is entirely true. Hit detection seems very borked and sometimes you simply cant hit an archer jumping and shooting at you resulting in him getting away and you getting severely hurt. In a 1 on 1 with both player having max health this is true and its the way it is supposed to be. A knight SHOULD kill an archer in close range, or at least an archer shouldnt kill a knight in hand to hand combat.

    All I know is 1 knight + 1 archer will normally win vs. 1 knight + 1 knight, for me archer is a supporter class when it comes to knight fights and I try to pick out builders and other archers.
     
  8. Monsteri

    Monsteri Slower Than Light Tester

    Messages:
    1,916
    May be just me, but I get killed constantly if I go too near and can't escape (wall behind me or I'm going downhill, so knights can glide to me) they kill me with their 6 meter long swords.
    Oh yeah and as I mentioned, you can glide them up easily.
    Archers need some as cool features as knights. I don't think anyone who likes to play archers disagrees with knights being a bit OP..

    Spam is their only feature right now. yesyesiknowwecanclimbtreesandarrowsbuttheyarenotusuallyveryuseful

    I think they need a counter to bombs - crawling = no hit?
    I think they need one cool unique feature more - can't think of anything
    Well, duh, archers would be cool and fun as an infliration + spy 2.o class.
    And knights need indirect nerfs.

    Uhh, yeah. I'm bad in telling my thoughts, I hope someone here will do it better :/

    The thing is, knights usuall fail realise they could just ignore that archer, shield and move on. If he is on a tree, jumping between them and spamming arrows, you could just shield and continue. If you want to kill him, just drive him off to your side of the map with your shield - some teammates will come and then he's fucked (unless he's very skilled, and then he deservers to not be caught). If he runs to his fort, so what, you just made your team travel safe!
     
    Contrary likes this.
  9. Wonkyth

    Wonkyth More precious than carbuncles! Donator Tester

    Messages:
    1,350
    I'd disagree. While the majority of the population is noob, the archer is FAR more efficient at wiping out knights than the knight is.
     
  10. Hella

    Hella The Nightmare of Hair Global Moderator Donator Tester

    Messages:
    1,655
    The only time they complain about OP knights is when they have been at their wrath. A well played knight is a good counter against a badly played archer; a well played archer can take on a well played knight. It's all about the technique when your on the field. In my opinion, all the classes are fairly well balanced at the moment, but if you can't play a class well compared to another, of course you will be prejudiced against the class that keeps beating you to a pulp!
    Knights aren't OP, just misunderstood... the archer, if anything, as Wonkyth says, is much better at taking out knights than knights are: when knights fight, then it is easier to reach a stalemate, particularly in tunnels, and particularly if you tend to shield at the slightest hint of danger (I myself am guilty of being a terrible knight :D)
     
  11. Knight1

    Knight1 Shark Slayer

    Messages:
    28
    How can you argue, two different classes that have two different jobs be OP. Arches have the job of spamming arrows, if they get into a situation that is close range OF COURSE they should loose. Its not their job to be up close, at all.
     
  12. NigerV2

    NigerV2 Shopkeep Stealer

    Messages:
    100
    I hate knight-players .Before nerf archer was fun to play class. But knight said that archer is not supposed to be fun .And now we have the most boring class in the game....Thanks knights
     
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