The Problem

To people who say that the counters are adequate: You're talking purely about playing pubs. As I frequently say on this forum, balance isn't as important versus scrubby pubbies because they're bad and you can roll them any way you like.

Notice how I make the distinction of saying games between good players. Organized matches are different and anyone's who's even played one patch knows that the counters are woefully inadequate.

Sorry to play the elitist card, but it would be cool if this game was actually balanced enough for clan matches and stuff.

 

Another idea is to have bombs destroy two blocks instead of just one. This would give knights more incentive to use a single bomb on a tower instead of an enemy, and to be able to destroy quickly erected towers more efficiently. I’d also like to see sticky bombs, perhaps if oil is released adding a bomb to oil would make it ‘sticky’, making them even more effective against buildings without having to time your throws.

I don’t like the idea of stone doors, as this thread was initially about buildings being OP, that’s just making them even more OP! Having wooden doors encourages creative thinking, since knights need power blows to destroy doors then placing them up high to prevent that is a tactic. Stone doors would just nerf knights even more than they already are against buildings, and make getting trapped with no escape too frequent.

 

Well ... making doors that can't be broken by knights isn't a better solution i guess ...
But removing teamtrapdoors, makes almost all spike pits useless and every other form of sweet spikey love (acavado spikes)

Only viable thing would be new trapblocks where both teams fall through but the team that placed them can see that they are for example "fake stone" while the enemys see them as "normal stone". Would be a hell lot of fun to design spike pits with those :D

Or if you want to remove the trapdoors then at least give us a siege weapon against knights like hot oil or something that we can pour over the knights trying to ram in the doors.

I also don't know how people will react when you take something away from them. I guess the pubs will be very angry about it. Even if the "elitists" would like the change, you also have to keep in mind that not everyone that bought KAG wants to play it competetive.

 

The problem I see, and correct me if I am wrong for I have only been around for a bit, is that the complaints are against one of the main mechanics of the game... building... So if I am correct here, the problems are that nobody can destroy buildings without having to work for it, knights are relatively useless against buildings unless en-masse or with constant bomb spamming, the fact that we have build time to actually MAKE SOMETHING to defend ourselves (one of the key reasons why people play this game), and the fact that build time is a resource gift that keeps people from raping the land early for resources and starving themselves before anything is actually built.

Let me be the one to call out here and look like the fool for disagreeing with the group, but the game would be boring without the strengths of buildings and the constant feeding of resources early game. If you buy the game then eventually you will have access to large explosives that can probably destroy half buildings in a moment's wait. If you need something torn down you call in a builder or two and you defend them with your life as a Knight. The game is class based warfare and it requires teamplay constantly. If you can't get into the enemies base because it's about seven stone deep, then you need to come find me in the fields building bunkers so our men don't get arrow raped to hell and I will personally come to their walls and destroy everything I can if you are willing to keep me alive, hell I might even be nice enough to put a door to keep them out to make your life easier.

In a clan match (something I love to do in other games) would you rather see massive holes and tunnels dug up everywhere for the sake of the builders having a few resources to work with? That might happen if we don't have starting resources, regening resources, or a build time. I don't like the idea of having to scramble around like a dieing ant trying to get enough stone to build the first line of defense as fifteen to twenty knights come charging in, and I can gladly tell you I won't be even remotely happy trying to build you a roof over your head so the arrow's don't tear you up before you even see the first enemy.


If my post is making me seem like some sort of imbecile then I am quite sorry, I am a worker by trade. I only go knight when some builder is having a hard time meeting his goal of location at which point I knight like a beast to see to it he has a good time and survives long after I get killed for him. I have yet to spend any true time being an archer as well, they may kill alot but they are easy to counter if you build a roof and keep knights from holding open doors. (I am so happy builders might get the little mobile roof thing for buying the game)

Should regen resources be something potentially looked into by the dev team may I be the first/insertnumberhere person to request it be a prem-exclusive benefit? I already wish I could carry more resources but to have the slow trickle of stone and wood, I would just be a happy camper and luckily a slow trickle also wouldn't break the game.




Tl;dr: Builders building large buildings keeps you alive for longer and keeps the game interesting. Train your builders to not suck.

 

Who said anything about removing trap doors?
Just prevent them from being used as ladders.

 

When it comes to the issue of buildings being over/underpowered; this

If knights can't break through team doors any more, AND you bring in siege equipment like transportable siege ladders and rolling siege towers, you're going to dissuade people from using teamdoors 10 blocks up because stone is much better to defend the top of a castle with over wood.

But it will also convince people to use team doors on the ground, or close to it, because knights now can't break through, and it's quick passage for your team mates that is at least a step above open blocks of air. I say knights shouldn't be able to break team doors... and PLEASE WAIT to change the features that already exist until you add siege weapons to the game. Just like in the medieval era, they will greatly change the balance of war in KAG.

It's not that buildings are overpowered, it's that Builders are magicians that can materialize entire walls within seconds, that, without counter-Builder resistance, can literally stand for the rest of the game and turn the tide of a match. This is a bit over-powered but I don't think Builders should get a "build time" like 2-3 seconds per block.

Give the other classes more weapons to bring structures down. The collapsing structures is the best part of the game! Builders can build sturdy structures fast. So give the other classes more weapons to take them down!

EDIT: Baron_Norab has it right with bombs and builders. Make bombs more of an anti-personnel frag grenade that does almost no damage to structures. Maybe keep the damage done to trap doors the same so knights can take down those sky bridges but I definitely think Builders need to be the sole destroyers of buildings unless a decent amount of resources is spent buying kegs and risking your life trying to plant them.

Also disagree with making fall damage worse.

 

I agree completely, build time is just ridiculous. Me and some other builder were trying to get to some entombing builder digging under our base. That's another issue with build time, entombing is too fucking easy. Anyway I was a knight and he was a builder and we were trying to get to him but it took us like almost half an hour because he could build blocks instantly. Like, why, why does it take like 5 people just to get to one builder effectively because he emtombs himself in. It's just insane. Entombing needs to stop right now, it's pathetic, it wastes both parties time and it's actually frustrating because you know if you don't chase this guy he's actually going to get into your base without even having to deal with ONE knight.

 

I disagree ! It will take forever to build a tower, generally, you've got about 2 or 3 second to build a wall in the middle of the map. With a build time for each block, every map would look like this

.......................................NO MAN's LAND.........................................

With blue team rushing and dying, and then red team rushing and dying. Boring no?
Knights should learn to fight in group and protect at any cost builder. Not trying to nerfing builder.

 

sorry i did a lot of editing. please refresh the page then respond to me. i completely changed my mind on that part haha. sorry about that

 

That's not true because if you think about it, build time has like 10-20 builders all placing blocks. A single tower wouldn't take a long time at all. Actually people building castles would require a builder to take the whole game doing it, giving them something to do constantly. Most games your main base is pretty much untouched unless you're losing which is stupid really. Why spend 3 minutes building this massive elaborate thing due to instant build time only for it to never see any action? Increased build time would make defenses harder to establish which means MORE base attacks because you wouldn't make middleground defenses as easily as you can now. That's what we're all here for right? We're here to see castles get attacked. We WANT our base to bear the full brunt of attack from the other side, but right now that never happens unless you're bound to lose!

 

Entombing should be a viable tactic to kill a builder underground. Seal up their hole(s) and then walk away while snickering knowing they'll die a slow death.

 

@Karlford

"without counter-Builder resistance"...

Well in that case, it's their own fucking fault if they lose, should have worked as a team and not played like idiots, which are the people the developers should not be catering to.

 

Oh yeah sure that would work but I think if the build time was reduced it would solve the problem more simply. Bottom line, destroying takes far too long and building is far too quick!

 

I'm here to dominate the map and catch the flag, not here to run right to left, left to right across the map.
The capabilities to nearly instabuild tower save us to run accross big map. I hate running.

 

Actually the game is fine the way it is, entombing yourself underground even though you are definitely going to lose should be a bannable offense.

 

Alright can you actually formulate an argument rather than swear and blame it on noobs?

Builders build extremely fast, and the structures they make can last all game. My suggestions are to wait until siege equipment is introduced into the game because those new weapons all by themselves might be enough to counter super-fast insta-castles being built.

And what does a team of idiots have to do with it? If you have a good team it's still possible that a new castle or wall that JUST got put up within 30 seconds in no-man's land by the enemy team can stand tall for the rest of the game. One side's gonna lose eventually. My suggestion is give us more stuff to blow shit up with.

EDIT: And I'm pretty sure Geti just said that they're going to slow kill you for entombing if there are no holes for you to breathe out of, so no need for bans.

 

Well entombing is definitely imbalanced. Two people should not be struggling just to catch up with one person just because building > destroying.

 

I don't think that blowing a tower is a good way to win a ctf, because you can't play only offensive, there is a moment that your offensive have to stop, and that you have to play defensive.
Convert tower > Blowing it up

 

No, if the team loses because of 1 shitty little building or wall that no one on the apposing team can be bothered to destroy then it is their own fault that they lost.

Oh and more siege equipment would be excellent, the developers should introduce a siege weapon called "DUR USE THIS TO BREAK WALL"

Seriously though, if you knew anything about future updates you would know that we are receiving powder kegs in the next update and more siege equipment later on.