[371] General archer discussion

In other words, good realism doesn't make a fun game. Please stop pointing out realism people, it doesn't mean anything in the vidya. You're not the only one Hoj, lots of people justify gameplay mechanics (or suggest new ones) on the basis of realism. Not a good ideology to base game development off of if you consider the best games ever made are usually the ones who favor gameplay over realism. I wonder where super mario would be if mario broke his ankle each time he stomped a goomba.

Just a pet peeve of mine I guess

 

the thing is you want the unrealistic shooting of an archer to be toned down to a more realistic level? hey i still vouch for toning it down but just pointing out why we are pointing out realism-nistic situations. besides being able to carrying 250 arrows is also sorta messed up

 

If we were really talking realism, a full power shot from close range would punch right through most knights(assuming they weren't in super top of the line armor), and the one's in said top of the line armor would be very slow. Assuming the archer was using bodkin's, possibly with pitch smeared on the end. Not looking for realism in the game, is my point, I guess. Though being able to buy armor piercing arrows with heavily reduced range would be sweet.

 

There comes a point in time when realism is required. Since almost all of the parts of this game were real at some point that rules out not having realistic parts. The skull while impressive has weaknesses that are real. The scale of the walls are obviously higher than what they look like(just to point that out to you)meaning gravity plus the velocity is lethal. Excuse me if i don't want one knight to tank all the archers on my team. The shield on the main screen is wooden at the core. Longbows during the middle ages took quite a lot of strength to use. Over one-hundred pounds of draw weight or more depending upon the man or woman. At that speed and the weight of the projectile you cannot argue against the numbers because they don't lie. As a side note to this statement; indians often shot more than one arrow at a time. Even you're Mongol Horde had a similar style of arrow firing. While the human body is a very impressive thing, it has weaknesses that are very real.

 

Spammed arrows do do half of a heart by default until you get above your opponent (which, by the way, is sorta bugged in the sens that diagonally shot arrows above an opponent have a reduced change to deal that extra .5 damage as compared to being directly above them). The problem is that spam when you're only slightly above your opponent, even by one tile, you'll deal an extra .5 hearts in damage.

Currently you can aim spammed arrows very, very easily and dish absurd damage because you can deal the damage from not-so-high distances. That's the problem. Like I said before, to alleviate this you can either cap the arrows or change the formula for how that extra damage is calculated. Ether way, it needs to be reworked to fit the extra damages purpose, which I assume would be for defense in towers.

It's two different solutions with two different implications. The cap on arrows would force archers to be more mindful of their shots while a rework of the extra-damage formula would mean that aim of the spammed arrows needs to be considered so that the DPS that the spammable arrows do is balanced in how hard it is to hit them from above with comparatively slow and easy to defend arrows.

 

I've found being an archer in a tunnel can be surprisingly useful. The power shots will stun the knight they hit allowing your teams knights to tear through the enemies a bit quicker which in a tunnel can mean the difference between winning and losing.

Oh and btw if you don't stop capitalising every word I may just go find a corner to cry in...

 

maybe it should be like the spy's revolver from tf2 where each hit/shot after in a quick succession deals less damage

 

I don't want the game to be one hundred percent realistic so you can drop you're snobby attitude. Trying to justify my actions compared to yours when your trying to defeat me is my motivation. Flying through the air like superman crushing foes makes up for a few arrows. Bomb jumping is like arrow spamming yes? Both are not thought of as useful actions yet sometimes they are. Being able to control rapid fire arrows isn't always easy. It takes considerable control to be able to hit a target. Same thing with bomb jumping. As i recall it's all about timing and skill. So when an archer fires arrows rapidly towards you, don't expect a massage to come of it. Some parts of this game should remain set in stone. Like this game i don't expect a fair conversation on these forums, that's what makes it more interesting. Thank you.

 

Sometimes being an archer is about deception and being able to lure a hungry knight to dinner. When a knight throws a bomb towards you it's safer to move towards it. When you run you meet up with the bomb and it kills you. Which, in the case of a desperate knight is not what they're expecting. Being able to evade your enemy is key in some circumstances. Evading is useful when they are charging at you; when they charge they tend to make mistakes which leads to a quicker death. Luring your enemy into a bad sitituation is another useful tool. Hitting a knight in the shield can also be used to make him or her fall to their death. With that said, a knight on top of a few knights has a similar effect. Deception is very useful.

 

Here's the new changelog, they added spectator mode.

Spoiler: BUILD 360-370 Changelogs

Changes 360-370:​

The numbers in the changelog are bug tracker report numbers.​

- fixed builders pick up catapult stone in mid air (#250)​

- add per-gamemode modding of archer variables​

- fixed crash where lightmap was null​

- fixed some hud readout bugs (thick stone)​

- fixed some issues with #164's fix and tree chopping​

- fixed trees heal when reaching the bottom of the trunk (#164)​

- fixed crash in menu when no player exists​

- backspace menu when not playing game is the same as when playing game​

- Added previous bitstream compatibility through *force_bool methods​

- fixed zombie mode order crash​

- fixed no spawn as zombie when changed team to red​

- fixed disconnecting from server when launched server browser​

- singleplayer gamemodes get paused when in ESC menu​

- fixed crash after launching zombie mode after deathmatch mode​

- zombie/migrant bodies collide in air with players and hurt them​

- added sound when zombies fall or hit walls​

- added random pitch variation for most sounds​

- added resource drop amount on hud​

- fixed migrant-player colliding​

- fixed big particles not spawned when in solid block​

- tweaked zombie network syncing​

- added spectator mode​

- fixed bot archers not shooting arrows​

- fixed wraith explosion on net​

- fixed wall hugging on ladder​

- added "killed by zombie message"​

- builder only stays close to buddy and defends himself from zombies​

- synced migrant bubbles on net​

- creative/Sandbox servers are also add to beginner servers now​

- fixed disconnecting player message​

- fixed crash when closed ingame browser at a wrong time​

- fixed zoom out from editor affecting other games (246)​

- fixed arrows going through walls (125)​

- workshop blocks cost 2 wood now​

- all CTF workshops cost 50 wood (no stone required) (+30 gold siege workshop)​

- migrants now say hello on network​

- backwall on spikes gives materials resolved (#208)​

- moved body throw offset a bit to avoid self collision​

- archer can't hurt others when stomping​

- fixed shield adding velocity on ground​

- made inventory counters 50x more awesome (and they read the correct numbers for more cases too)​

- fixed coins from frozen players​

- dropped amount of coins from shooting catas (IRC request)​

- fixed custom heads for non-admins​

- made guard hat only apply to builder head and class default head​

- added custom head check in player (checks if name matches a custom head player or if is guard or admin)​

- added class modding to CTF rules​

- bound runner variables to rules​

- added falldamage vars to rules config (-> balancing ahoy)​

- fixed crash in starter caused by autoupdate not initialised​

- nerfed sheild push to help with desync and wall damage​

- fixed wall sliding + fixed notch jumping (related)​

- added server_setup_info.txt and readme.txt​

- modified readme.txt and server_setup_info.txt for nicer formatting​

- added stats format info to server_setup_info.txt​

- added /listbans function to list all currently active bans​

- fixed bug in bans (time was in seconds not minutes)​

- made bans more user friendly with their output​

- stats updated to more easily parsable format​

- fixed typo in tutorial (#197)​

 

This thread is now out of date, see build [393].

Locked.