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Dead game is dead...

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Leo, Sep 23, 2014.

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  1. Geti

    Geti Please avoid PMing me (poke a mod instead) THD Team Administrator Global Moderator

    Just to clean up an old direct response as well:
    I've posted about ten times recently about why there haven't been patches recently. Before then there were bugfixes every couple of weeks.
    See the graphs I posted, it gets up to 200 at a time. http://grab.by/CexE here's the last month in per-day players. Here's the last year http://grab.by/CexU , in between spikes it's pretty stable.
    It does to us, it puts a roof over our heads and feeds us and our families. We do this as a job, as well as for the love of it, and if we don't sell copies we can't make more games. Making money from KAG directly funds our future games by keeping us alive. It's a necessity.
    Fuck you, guy, I've been an active part of this community engaging directly with people playing it in game, on the forums and via irc for years running.

    Not a bug.
    It tends to crash more often when re-joining actually. This is our current top-priority bug to fix, but thanks for the ever-present reminder.
    Specifically? Or just "GAME IMBA"?
    I'm still here aren't I? Can't speak for MM, though he'd probably tell me not to waste time on you. Lucas cares so much he made a classic patch.
    The game hasn't been in beta since steam launch. I'm not full time at the moment because I'm in the middle of exams, and noone is full time on KAG since it's not in beta and we've got new stuff going on too.
    Again, fuck you, guy.
    I've got a clear inbox and notification stack on the forums, regularly hang out in irc, play a handful of times each week, am working with the guys trying to get gather up and running, help people get tournaments off the ground, and even check the steam forums every now and again. We're actively working with the community up to and including code contributions, the new build's changes are by and large sourced from community feedback.
    As I said I've explained across the boards (which we're all supposed to have read all of and memorised to be responsible, right?) about the build server situation - I've even made a handful of devlog posts about it while going through my final university exams to make sure people are informed.
    I'm much more a part of this community and these forums than you with your 72-posts-in-a-year-of-registration, and you're blind to think otherwise, and rude to assert it.
    The game hasn't been in beta since steam launch. Also, see my post above to Vidar.
  2. revsta

    revsta Shipwright

    This quote: which, given that you're speaking to an admin and we lost a good friend & admin to cancer only recently, makes his reading understandable even if that's not what you intended.

    Is referring to me speaking the truth about a game no matter how I've said it, ie. if a doctor tells you you have cancer it doesn't matter how he tells you, you still have cancer. I have no idea about any admins here dying of cancer, that wasn't the intention in any regard.
    --- Double Post Merged, Nov 16, 2014, Original Post Date: Nov 16, 2014 ---
    Lol. Fuck me guy. Okay. Don't bother with any of the actual content I've posted for suggestions, just go fuck yourself. I'm done with this shit. I can't believe I even wasted this much time talking to idiots who clearly can't run a game and morons who clearly don't want their game to continue to have a good player base.
    Fuzzle likes this.
  3. EhRa

    EhRa Ooooooof Staff Alumni Donator
    1. KRPG

    ..... Kouji died of Cancer, one of the greatest admins we had.

    You really are an idiot aren't you. Theres always people like you who hate games like this. @Geti is a great Dev and all the Admins/Guards are very helpful. Your just a whiner and you make a bad name for a community as great as this.
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2014
    Blue_Tiger likes this.
  4. FuzzyBlueBaron

    FuzzyBlueBaron Warm, Caring, Benign, Good and Kind Philanthrope Global Moderator Forum Moderator Donator Tester
    1. The Young Blood Collective - [YB]


    Just leave him, eragon. At this stage I think the best thing is to move on.
    J-man2003 likes this.
  5. Auburn

    Auburn Prepare Yourself! Forum Moderator Staff Alumni Donator Tester
    1. SharSharShar - [SHARK]

    @revsta what content?

    Builders need score- suggested long before you came along, and was also in classic. Minecrafters were at the top of the scoreboard.

    Bombs need a nerf- suggested before, refuted by: it's a versatile weapon, that requires more skill than you think to wield properly. Also it's a knight's only real way to defeat pro archers and builders.

    Bugs/Lag/Crashes- Devs knew about those long before you came along and Geti explained why some of these haven't been fixed yet.

    Bad Admins w/ superiority complex- Play on different servers if you don't like that server's administration. Also, admins are human beings. Human beings are not perfect. Sometimes, we make wrong calls, that doesn't mean we're out to get everyone that doesn't build a certain way.

    Shit Community- Like an apple tree, it produces good apples, and bad ones. Speaking from personal experience here, I personally love this community. Before @Nighthawk introduced me to KAG, I used to play a lot of MMORPGs. I joined clans, went on raids, but was never able to form a connection to their communities. Possibly because if you didn't fit a certain role, no one wanted you. I had always tried to build my own character, and not follow the guides to build "perfect" characters. I wanted to play the game however I felt like playing it. Sadly, if you didn't make you build to stun-lock enemies, you were pretty much useless to every clan and party out there. KAG is different though. I have seen so many playstyles of the same 3 classes, each play style being a perfectly viable way to play the game. Each person has their own play style, thus, each person actually makes a difference in the game. In KAG there's also no instant win formula like there is in other games. Unique play styles leads to others in the community appreciating you for more than just another tank, or another DPS. I've ended up making some pretty great friends through this community. Hell, I'd rather spend my Friday nights playing KAG with these guys and having a blast, than getting drunk, high, or both at the next college party, not remembering anything and having a terrible hangover the next day.
  6. Fellere825

    Fellere825 KAG Guard Tester

    It is a simple philosophy for a multiplayer game. Its the people who effect multiplayer not the game. You can have the shittiest game in the world but if your friends are all playing it you will want to as well. Because no one wants to be left alone. Case in point example, many players in the Shark mumble constantly succumb to peer pressure and play KAG not because they are in love with the gameplay but because other people in the mumble are playing it. Yes it does help to have a good product to attract groups of friends to play the game, but ultimately its the people you play with that effects how long you stay or your enjoyment of the game. This is a double edged sword for the THD developers. On one hand you can generate a large influx of players because of the connectivity of a multiplayer game. On the other if you have no friends or if you cannot make new friends then you will not want to continue playing the multiplayer game.

    In general this community is not the friendliest bunch to newcomers. One issue that comes to mind is that the community as a whole does not respond positively to people who enjoy playing "casually building". Often times these "casual" players who are building something completely separate from the norm are labeled "minecrafters" or "fucking idiots" and are highly frowned upon. This type of ostracism of experimentation and creativity leads to stale game-play in what is supposedly a sandbox game.

    Yes this game is competitive. Yes the good of the team is generally favored over the good of the individual for this game. Yet this democratic idealism is where the problem lies. There will be a core demographic that is more outspoken or more stubborn about what should be the "optimal" play style. KAG is very political. Even in development the community has been an issue. Features are added and taken out by the most outspoken members of the community whilst those whose ideals are opposite of the majority are ridiculed and debased. (All of those threads made by 12 year old kids about class suggestions, all of those threads about something magical, all those threads about ninjas or tanks) What should happen is a general acceptance of said ideals instead of a complete shut down.

    Nearly every prominent member of this community has made at least one shitty suggestion in this forum. Nearly every old fag has made a thread that has been, for lack of a better term, shit. But that is human nature and criticizing those new kids who happened across KAG, those individuals who minecraft, those individuals who love the game so much that they visit the forum for the first time and suggest their ideas of ninjas or medics, will not fix anything.

    tl;dr Through psychological indoctrination and peer pressure we can be expected to increase the community who play this game by more then 1.
  7. Brandon816

    Brandon816 Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Jeez, I can hear this commotion from all the way over in the classic forums. :huh?:

    Btw, this revsta guy is literally 4 more posts shy of half his total 78 post count being in this thread alone. All of this because of some axe he has to grind between getting a day ban for something he feels he shouldn't have gotten punished for, getting votekicked by children a few times, and the dev's "wasting" time trying to give the game some more life through new game modes (latest one being trench run) and new game mechanics for the main "KAG" game type (apparently what Skinney just got hired on for). Not sure why some of you are wasting your time writing essays in response to his rants, when he's clearly not going to bother reading them except to find something else to argue about.
    Dargona1018 and Fernegulus like this.
  8. Fernegulus

    Fernegulus Bison Rider

    alright now what the fuck are you doing
    you're all being shitters (yes even you fbb)
    although you try the hardest to keep calm and fight fairly you start your own flamewar, an even worse one, because it's all offtop
    plus, it's all "a huge exaggeration."
    why don't we discuss happily and ignore every troll (btw gj revsta, jesus christ you trolled them for like 3 pages and now, after this ended they're convinced of their victory lol)
    you failed, every one of you who opposed him.

    now to topic
    it is not a huge exaggeration that KAG is filled with a bugs
    you're either lying or incredibly lucky
    in both cases the truth is different
    and really i dont have to point out every bug
    so to keep this fairly short and quick: kag is buggy as shit + the mechanics are shit and i obviously blame kag team yet at the same time understand them and im not butthurt, as ive done nothing (for i could not) to help them
    there is still hope
    geti pls fix
  9. TR is a separated game.
  10. Fuzzle

    Fuzzle Grand Grumbler

  11. FuzzyBlueBaron

    FuzzyBlueBaron Warm, Caring, Benign, Good and Kind Philanthrope Global Moderator Forum Moderator Donator Tester
    1. The Young Blood Collective - [YB]

    @Blue_Tiger, I deleted you last two posts as off-topic (rather than labeling your first as flame-bait --- I get that you were just cracking a joke, but srsly mate, just leave it and dun kick a man while he's down; unless it's Hella, ofc).

    Other people, srsly, let's just move on from revsta and keep it on-topic if that's at all possible. :huh?:
    Fernegulus likes this.
  12. Fuzzle

    Fuzzle Grand Grumbler

    RadioActive likes this.
  13. Galen

    Galen Haxor Staff Alumni Donator

    Okay folks, this is the last warning. I don't know why you're still posting stuff like this, @Fuzzle, even after FBB just told you what to do ONE POST ABOVE YOUR OWN.

    We will start handing out warnings from this post on for everything that has nothing to do with the OP or "how do we as a community make things better?". You're warned. I hate doing stuff like this but it had to be done.

    //EDIT: apparently it wasn't obvious that I was referring to everyone in that last paragraph. Hope it is now. ~Galen
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2014
  14. Contrary

    Contrary The Audacious Paramount of Explosive Flight Donator Tester

    The magic @ symbol! @Geti you have summoned me!

    KAG is a bad game, but it is a bad game we love. I think that makes it so much better than a good game that no one is really passionate for. In fact I think that it's necessary for games to be a little unbalanced, glitchy, or otherwise broken in order for them to truly inspire passion. But that's a bunch of theoretical ramblings for another time.

    Y'all may not know this, but all of my time active on the forums was also time active in the game. To this day I have to restrain myself from coming back to this old addiction because I love playing KAG so much. I love bomb jumping around, I love slashing folks, I love mining and building. I even love seeing dumb glitches or just standing around, having funny interactions with other players. In some ways I even love getting mad. Deep inside, we all feel this way. Geti et al should be proud of what they've done here and they should feel good about hanging it up and calling it a day.

    Honestly, the sun is setting on KAG and there's no point in drawing it out. I thought they would have moved on over a year ago, and I'm kinda sad they haven't. KAG is a big bowl of spaghetti code slathered with a big helping of broken glitch sauce with a side of bad community meatballs. For those who have been around a long time, you'll know that KAG has changed wildly through it's life, and the only constant that it has been totally, irrevocably, endearingly, broken. Even if that could be changed, it shouldn't be. KAG is not high-cuisine. It's that weird homebrew dish that you love eating but are embarrassed to explain to anyone else. It's maple syrup on pizza pops, it's french fries and chocolate. Let it be weird, and messy, and kind of dumb.

    The only thing that's really changed is that KAG has stopped moving. Over time it has slowed down and come to a place where the gameplay is better than ever and the community is most adverse to trying new things. KAG has accumulated so much baggage that every step forward is a painful limp. I don't go here much anymore but it's plain as day, every time the devs try something new, there's such a sharp backlash from the community that I wonder how Geti hasn't just retreated from the community altogether. Because he does care what you have to say, far too much in fact. Many times in testing someone would have a great idea and everyone would agree on how much it would improve the game- but Geti will wearily explain that it would probably generate too much hate from the community at large and the idea is tossed aside.

    So why oh why are you forcing this emaciated Australian boy to continue suffering? You are giving him contradicting blueprints to build an impossible house on a broken foundation. Let him use his big brain to make other stuff.
    Aegis, J-man2003, Lieber and 10 others like this.
  15. Fuzzle

    Fuzzle Grand Grumbler


    This makes me sad; what you and the developers haven't realised yet is that King Arthur's Gold doesn't need nifty gameplay tweaks as the ones they've been pushing the past few updates -- nifty balance tweaks that have oust the difference between two teams causing more stalemates than ever. Anything else; from achievments to an improved banning system, tickets .. Focus has been awry, and it seems to be stuck at the bottom. @Contrary helps it to stay down there ( .. or remove it completely ). Thanks.
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2014
  16. Beelzebub

    Beelzebub Ballista Bolt Thrower

    kouji's dead?

    fuck this shit ::(:
    wilpin7 likes this.
  17. 16th

    16th Bison Rider

    This is not true. And confirmation of this, the number of players online. Back in the days, before steam and beta, servers were more filled.
    I love KAG. Its concept is truly unique. I play it from earliest builds, and every change (although sometimes we had to learn to play again) were change for good. When I learned that MM is planning to rewrite the engine, I was overjoyed. New features promised us were gorgeous! And then...Geti voiced above what we already knew. They need money > they decided to release the game on Steam > in order not to scare off new players they have simplified and redesigned gameplay > fuckdup the ballance > now KAG dead...And this is wery sad, coz that game, inho, deserves much more.
    I still keep hoping... ::(:
    RadioActive, Sturm and PussyDestroyer like this.
  18. PorkChop808

    PorkChop808 Catapult Fodder

    What were the balance changes when they released it on steam? I only heard/played the game after it went onto steam.
  19. Geti

    Geti Please avoid PMing me (poke a mod instead) THD Team Administrator Global Moderator

    This is not really true, fwiw.
    Here's a year-long look since the steam release (the peak shortly after the start) - here's the time period with per-day player counts instead of simultaneous player counts.

    The steam release point is the highest those graphs have ever gotten, and for the two years before, the only big spike was around zombies release (which I think neatly coincided with TB or yogscast previewing the game, though I'm not 100% on the timing there), and the graph was largely stable around that 2k average per day mark, which seems to be the "stable point" for the game. During classic it got as high as 4k a day a few times, and as low as 500. During public beta the total player count actually picked up a little as some old players came and revisited the game. The highest I ever saw classic was ~500 players, in the middle of some publicity spike, and the majority of them were free players.

    I've got a feeling this conception of there being more players around in the alpha days is largely due to nostalgia, but it definitely gets quite empty in some regions (though at peak in each region there's always at least one full server).

    Balance changes for steam specifically were not large, but before steam release there was a public "beta" phase that changed a lot of the core game. You can still play the classic version to compare the changes for yourself, though it's quite a different game.

    Very very sorry to hear you're just learning this now. There's a nice memorial thread in announcements if you want to read, and if you want me to pass on anything to his family or anything, let me know via PM, we're keeping contact there.
    wilpin7, Blue_Tiger and Yagger like this.
  20. 16th

    16th Bison Rider

    But this progression sloping. In classic was the same? (sorry for poor english)
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