General Knight Changes

It seems I have not phrased that very well.
Don't use real world logic as a reason for changing game elements in a way that would affect balance.
understand now?

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Anyway, knight nerfs.
Knights should only be able to get up 6-7 blocks unassisted. Not 9-10.
bombjumping height and ease of use nerfed.

^This is so front line buildings can actually stop knights for more than two seconds.

 

You guys need to seriously stop suggesting Bomb jumping nerfs... Get better builders or become on yourself and make either the walls higher or smack a roof ontop... preferable a roof with stone doors so you can dispatch the knight before he has a chance to drop two bombs and break a hole in it... it's getting pretty effing old when someone suddenly says "KNIGHT OP! PLS NERF" Just stop your bitching and play better.. sheesh.... :I

 

build higher.
higher than 45 blocks, you mean? (yes, I can double bomb jump this high)
you shouldn't have to build that high to stop bomb jumping knights. Bomb jumping completely disregards the builders main use:
building.

As for roofs, they are as almost as expensive as making an entire new tower, and they take a lot of time to build.

 

Not everyone know's how to bomb jump. Only a certain number of people do.... :o
It takes some practice but it's not known to everyone.

 

All the agrees. All of them. And yea, you should just.. try to learn the combat.
But if you dont wanna, I know some stuff about combat. The most obvious rule, spam jab like no tomorrow... even in the air.. which is quite silly looking xD
Another rule of combat, always come flying at the enemy as fast as humanly possible, apparently your speed = murder. Plus height also works too, mostly cuz your stomping your enemy when you smack. But from what I can tell, lag aids you.. cause when you attack, that hit box of the attack is still present when you backoff, so your enemy will land on the block before it despawns a second later. The speed part is still a bit confusing.. but it seems that slower you are the quicker you'll die. But the faster you're moving and how much your managing to stay in the air... you can kill more.. untill your groove is broken...

That to me is how it works... :I

 

I think the just the opposite BlueLuigi. I'm finding that for the very first time KAG is forcing me to choose between options based on what I think the other person will do, the rock paper scissors as you said. I basically never felt that way in classic. True, Beta jabs are rarely a good option against an opponent full health, but that's better than classic where they were always a good option- sometimes to the point beating both slash and shield. In classic jabs often randomly beat slash and shield isn't even a good answer as unless both players have a perfect connection you can't reliably counter jab.

I'm finding that with the superior hit detection and the new momentum system there's a lot of depth gained. Not only is spacing more important but being creative when approaching your enemies is not only necessary but has expanded possibilities with new movement options and the refinement of old ones.

I think the difference is really clear when you look at the spread of KDs in classic compared to beta, even pre-steam beta. I can name dozens of beta knights who get consistently get over 3KD- the only person I recall who could do that in the most recent incarnation of classic is Vidar who cheated and avoided the shitty knight combat by simply spamming bombs.

The transition to beta is very difficult as your classic reflexes will fight you all the way. I too hated beta at first and refused to play it, but after a break that allowed my old skills to wane a bit I took to beta and never turned back.

 

Of course I'm not saying that KD is everything, but a greater disparity in KDs within the general populace suggests that there are more consistent results in combat, ie. skill matters more. I'm finding that playing with lag is much easier, even in Australia I'm easily able to go toe to toe with Aussie vets, whereas in classic 300+ ping was a death sentence even vs plebs. Anyways good to see you're giving beta fair shot, hope you eventually enjoy it.

 

I know it just annoys some of you people when someone mentions nerfing bombjumping but really. . .if so many people have issues with it then maybe it does have problems?

I wonder if when bomb jumping gets to be popular(as it isn't very hard to learn) there will be a community cry out like there was with water ammo(which still could use a tweak). . .

Also it is hard to complain that people don't know how to counter bombjumpers when if you know how to double bombjump then you most likely will have the skill to get over most towers and have the skill to at least kill 2-3 people in even a bad position, you also will have an opening to break anything on their roof(or inside the base if there is no roof), and you will have the high ground. . .If you have the skill to triple bomb jump(something I just learned how to do) then nothing stands in your way. . .The skill cap negates the existence of the builder class, pretty much.

If someone would like to explain to me legitimate reasons why bombjumping and its ability to get you over anything is balanced, be my guest, I would actually really like to hear why.

Spoiler: Something more about Builders than Knights, but also about balance. Kinda long and offtopic. . .

And admittedly I wouldn't mind a nerf on bombjumping if the builder class could somehow have a buff on their offensive abilities, as the current reason we still see games that come to endless standoffs is because of two reasons:

Builders currently only exist to make games longer and to build a few shops at the start of the game, their ability to make games longer can be extended almost infinitely at its current state and also is the cause of why games end very abruptly, on top of that it is why the vast majority of the community doesn't see that Builders need a buff and a nerf at the same time.

The second reason, and the one that needs changed the most, is that even though there are MANY ways to assault a fort the Builder's ways are the least effective! Drills? Knights use them better! Siege weapons? Knights can buy them as easily and can actually defend them! Getting over a tower? Knights and archers don't need help! Getting through a tower? Bomb arrows, Kegs, Knights with Drills, Mines, and siege being run by Knights. . .The best thing the Builder can do is tunnel and people HATE tunneling. Builders just don't survive on the battlefield like they did in Classic, and without them there we keep the "Classic forts" which are too strong to be beaten, but lose the "Classic builder assault" which could beat those forts! This is also why you hardly see important forts being made on the battlefield mid-game, you can't build an effective fort within a few seconds. . .and even if you do a keg will remove it right away.

Long post is long...

 

because if im good enough to outplay entire opposite team i should be able to do it and not stare at them and let them play minecraft?
if im not good enough they will kill me as a i try to bombjump

here, have your explanation

 

crabmaster, I agree fully.
when I play ctf, I hardly ever touch the front of a tower. I just bomb jump over it, and either:
- take it down from the back with a mine.
- or blow through the flag case, grab the flag and ignore the tower completely.

Bombs and mines are the best stratagy on ctf.

so @Ej, you are saying this:
If I can take out their entire team in open combat,
then I should have the means to fight them in open combat,
regardless of the buildings put there to stop me.

what? That is extremely arrogant. By your logic, building should just be removed from kag, as your skill in combat is the only thing that matters. People like you should stay in tdm.

imo, kag should be about teamwork. Not owning entire teams by yourself.

 

You fucking retards. See here how OP bombjumping is:


Constantly stopped and no big damage done.
E: Seems to start at 1:22 for some reason, go to the beginning to the 1st match.

 

I think a solid snipe should immediately send a bomb jumper falling. There are plenty of times when the enemy doesn't have an archer on top anyway so it would make archers more useful since hitting a bomb jumping knight in mid-flight (And dealing damage, mind you, not hitting the shield) would send him falling. Anything that encourages precision shooting is good in my book.