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[1215] Archers

Discussion in 'Archer' started by -Tj-, Aug 16, 2014.

  1. TheDirtySwine

    TheDirtySwine Bison Rider Staff Alumni Donator

    Messages:
    818
    Lol @Anonymuse and I were just discussing that in another thread
     
    FuzzyBlueBaron and Anonymuse like this.
  2. Klokinator

    Klokinator Such Beta
    1. Aphelion's Roleplay

    Messages:
    1,443
    Archers are pretty rape in packs now. You can't even get close to them as a knight if they cluster together.

    To be fair... the same used to be true for archer v knights so, it's more fair I guess.
     
  3. Shadowor

    Shadowor Shark Slayer

    Messages:
    184
    Archer is fine the way it is. It can be OP sometimes, but it takes a lot of skill to use it properly. When I'm a knight I just mow down the archers, but against good archers I can struggle too. The problem is that most player sees the knight superior over the archer. That is not true, they are different but not necessarily stronger.
    They have different roles, jobs and way of playing. Archer is either supporting or takes down walls, while knight is fighting out the battlefield. I hardly see an archer who has bigger score on the board than a knight. Many player cries when 3 archer kills him as a knight, but forgots the fact that it is still a 3 vs 1 fight.

    But still if you use knight properly, you can block that 30 arrow without any effort. And if you still die, what did you expect? 3 archer won't shoot you down and you just laugh at them? Come on, we are talking about a combined archery defense.
    Or if your problem is with the archer who can move, shoot and play like a pro, then deal with the fact that he is just simply better and you failed to take him down with a single slash.
    Yup... I think I summed it up. Archers don't rule the battlefield, knight does. Learn to play the game the way it is, don't beg for changes because you can't kill everyone.

    //EDIT Don't use so many Bolds and Underlines in your text next time. ~Gurin
     
    Dargona1018 likes this.
  4. AJFaas

    AJFaas Base Burner
    1. supr sekrit cln [skrt]

    Messages:
    164
    im just gonna go and repost what i wrote in the other section here. And hope that geti reads it because thats what i care about only If you guys wanna rage at my opinion, then go slam your face against the wall for all i care.

    Yo guys,
    I was playing kag today and suddenly something snapped in my head and realised that archers are just too fucking OVERPOWERED. Before, I was like; well they might be strong, but fuck it i can best them and find a weakness. But guess what theres no real weakness. Dont get me wrong im not gonna post a solution here. its not my game. Thats your job, geti. Im just gonna point out why they are too strong.
    When you chase an archer he can just charge his arrow accordingly to how you move and when you get too close he can fire 3 shots off and get 2 certain hits. You heard right the archer will get 2 hearts off before you get in stabbing range. This means that archers are better at close combat than knights when youre having 1vs1. This will also mean that you get shot away at a distance the archer can load up new arrows and repeat the same process.
    The other problem is that archer can just keep shooting powerfull arrows and shoot you away and run away again. Theoretical they can just keep knights away indefinitely.
    People might say that you can still throw bombs at archers. To what i answer; i wanna kill archers without spending money. it doesnt make sense that you MUST buy items to kill someone. Also archers can shoot water arrows at you right before you wanna throw it to which it will blow in your hands.
    Ive tried MANY things to kill archers and none seems effective but pure skill, trickery and mostly luck. like jumping in the air right before the archer shoots which comes down to luck.
    Also when youre up against a knight and hes being backed by an archer i feel absolutely powerless. You cant do a thing or you get a arrow in your face, while trying to time your attack to kill the knight. Again it comes down to luck.
    I dont wanna brag but im a decent knight in kag and i tried many things to fight archers. but theyre simply put: Too powerful.
    Also this was going on before this latest patch. Also on a note, why the fuck doesnt stabbing, interrupt archers like it interrupts knights...
    I hope youre taking this complaint seriously, geti. I believe this is a real problem and im not one to easily say that things are unfair etc. Also im not saying theyre HUGELY overpowered. But im guessing you want perfect balance. and thats definitely not the case right now nor before this update.
     
  5. Nighthawk

    Nighthawk gaurenteed shitter

    Messages:
    793
    I'm sorry, but I disagree with pretty much this whole post, and it needs only one correction:
    Skilled Archers are overpowered.

    As I've said before, the skill curve for Archers is practically vertical, but when you get up there you can be really annoying and OP. But scrub Archers? Ha. I can kill them as a Knight and I play Knight like 5% of the time, if that gives you an idea of how skilled I am.
     
    Dargona1018 likes this.
  6. AJFaas

    AJFaas Base Burner
    1. supr sekrit cln [skrt]

    Messages:
    164
    I thought it was pretty obvious I only meant good archers. weak archers are weak and get caught easy yet can be annoying as hell hiding behind other knights or on walls. My problem is that a good archer is almost unbeatable and i tried many stuff. no weaknesses at all. Everything you can do; they have something against it.
     
  7. TheDirtySwine

    TheDirtySwine Bison Rider Staff Alumni Donator

    Messages:
    818
    Ya know what happened to knights because of skilled players? They were nerfed hard. I'm sorry but I wouldn't feel bad if archers got a nerf too.
     
  8. Dargona1018

    Dargona1018 Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Messages:
    569
    I've said it before, I'll say it again:
    They are still the same archers.

    The only reason they seem OP is because we are getting smart. Look at the last couple of main builds, and I bet you that Archers have stayed the same. Now, there isn't JUST Trumbles. There is also Oodle, and Illusion, and weman, and all the random archers, and the reason why they can kill you easily? Because you don't know how to deal with them.

    Before, archers were worthless worms of a class, easily killable and a waste of a team slot.
    Now that we are all proved wrong, we are all getting butthurt and raging at how archers can finally kill you.
    It's not their fault for getting good, it's your fault that you can't seem to adjust.
     
    neil58, SirDangalang and Nighthawk like this.
  9. Jepton

    Jepton Shipwright

    Messages:
    147
    If you look at the update log, all is says for the archer is that it reduces arrow stun range.

    Knight balancing was the main point, it seems. Archers haven't changed much at all.
     
  10. TheDirtySwine

    TheDirtySwine Bison Rider Staff Alumni Donator

    Messages:
    818
    They don't need to change for them to become OP. Knight mobility was severely nerfed. Archer has a grapple and can run away from you better than ever before. It's not as easy to kill someone you can't get close too. I'm also seeing a ton more archers now than ever before. They are even more OP in packs. A knight cannot get close to them without a bomb or other archers. Any archer can kite a knight forever now that knights can't get onto buildings via wallclimbing. It's very frustrating from a knights perspective.
     
  11. EhRa

    EhRa Ooooooof Staff Alumni Donator
    1. KRPG

    Messages:
    810
    Archers in real life are Beast in packs. Deal with it.
     
  12. NinjaCell

    NinjaCell Haxor

    Messages:
    358
    That's because archer combat is relatively the same this build as the last, whereas knight combat is very different. So there are naturally at this moment more skilled archers than knights.
     
  13. archer has been theoretically OP ever since arrow slashing removal

    however since most players really do their best to fuck up as much as possible, I don't think it's relevant, really

    not talking about balance unless you can master every each class seems to be a good idea
     
  14. Fernegulus

    Fernegulus Bison Rider

    Messages:
    400
    LOL are you even serious, KAG isn't about winning the game by yourself, somehow though the KAG community is too retarded for a little bit of teamwork. Maybe it's the russians, maybe the steamfags, maybe the polish gamers, but still they can't into teamwork. Every class or technique is superior to another one under specific circumstances, and if you only played fucking together, not like mindless lemmings, maybe you could take advantage of it. For one, tanking with your shield won't get you far, because you won't hurt anyone and eventually get rekt. Slashing mindlessly won't help too, neither will jabbing, and, of course, combining those styles is extremely rewarding, that's the skill in KAG. Just why not go one step further, and use packs of knights doing stuff? People already do shit like going around as 3 knights, but if they only weren't jumping like lemmings... Actually it's pretty hard to imagine a kag player without a derpface and his eyeballs rotating wildly and independently. So lol on, and shut up.
    --- Double Post Merged, Aug 26, 2014, Original Post Date: Aug 26, 2014 ---
    The only thing about archers I would do is again use a tested classic feature, that is slow them down while charging a shot. No that's not fucking too much nerf. When a fucking ninja archer came in classic, you couldn't do anything. I remember facing Landoo. Holy shit, that was so fucking frustrating.
     
  15. AJFaas

    AJFaas Base Burner
    1. supr sekrit cln [skrt]

    Messages:
    164
    I really hate to say it but im actually one of the best knights on kag and im not saying it to brag, because i dont give a shit and its not something to be proud of. the fact just is that i have a fucking hard time killing people like malfunction and even more archers that are getting the hang of it. All they do is play, catch me if you can.
    When youre out there on the field and you wanna kill people, those archers keep slipping away at the right moment shoot you with bombardments of arrows. All you can do is be really really patient and wait till they slip up. Because i know the facts; the truth is that an archer cant even kill a knight in 1 vs 1 if the knight is just holding his shield up the whole time. But then youd just get a staring contest. It comes down to that knights always need to show initiative to kill the archers which will get them impatient eventually and leave open spots for the archer. And thats just not fun gameplay.
    Edit
    Just wanna note that I dont hate you malfunction. You cool. Just named you as an example for a good archer.
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2014
  16. Yagger

    Yagger Kouji's bitch 5eva Staff Alumni Tester
    1. SharSharShar - [SHARK]

    Messages:
    646
    that means you aren't the best if you can't kill more experienced archers then, sherlock shitler

    archers aren't constant arrow p/second firing machines. the only major challenges are trying to solo >groups< of archers, which of course you shouldn't be able to do safely w/o bombs or explosives. they run out eventually, or screw up which allows you to move up.

    [​IMG]
     
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  17. AJFaas

    AJFaas Base Burner
    1. supr sekrit cln [skrt]

    Messages:
    164
    The thing is that they can run away forever. Shoot a water arrow when you wanna throw a bomb, and shoot 3 arrows at you once you get too close, killing 2 hearts off you. Theres no solid tactic just luck. What i just said covered long range mid range and short range. What else is there.
     
    Fuzzle likes this.
  18. Dargona1018

    Dargona1018 Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Messages:
    569
    Confusion. You say you are best knight, and yet you can't kill a single good archer.
    There are probably a huge amount of people better than you, than.
    Gurin, sangfroid, possibly Yagger (keyword: possibly), Heck, I can even kill good archers.
     
  19. Auburn

    Auburn Prepare Yourself! Forum Moderator Staff Alumni Donator Tester
    1. SharSharShar - [SHARK]

    Messages:
    734
    I'm not sure if you've heard of it, but there's this thing called DODGE THE FUCKING ARROWS. Or at least dodge the water ones, block the regular ones. Something tells me you really aren't a good knight, as I have no problems dealing with less than 5 archers at a time.
     
    Dargona1018 likes this.
  20. AJFaas

    AJFaas Base Burner
    1. supr sekrit cln [skrt]

    Messages:
    164
    Its funny that you guys keep saying that im not a good knight even thought I said that I actually am but dont give a crap about it. I just wanna show a comparison.
    And please just read what im saying because youre saying stuff i covered.
    And aubrun you have no problem with dealing with 5 archers at the time? lol youre a fucking bragger with no limit. if 5 archers fire shots at you, you got an arrow machine gun.
    Also to get it straight I CAN kill good archers its just a fucking hell to do. Its boring and it depends if the archer screws up, and includes chasing after the archer through the whole fucking map, if he feels like it, until you stumble upon his teammates.
     
    Fuzzle likes this.