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[1239] Ideas on building time - ClanWars

Discussion in 'Builder' started by 8x, Nov 10, 2014.

  1. 8x

    8x Elimination Et Choix Traduisant la Realité Forum Moderator Tester Official Server Admin
    1. The Young Blood Collective - [YB]

    In this post I'll try to place some ideas on what to do during the building time at cws or competitive-serious matches. There's more people and interest on the competitive scene nowadays, so let's try to share thoughts and ideas on advanced (harharhar) building or defensive/offensive structures.

    Please feel free to share your thoughts on this thread, but don't post too obvious things or spam "that thing is easy to destroy with 3 bombs/i can bypass that castle and own you with my left hand", as we already know that structures in KAG 1.0 get destroyed easily and need constant repair/rebuild. Let's keep it simple ">

    My first thoughts:

    1st. Having a treefarm at the base is a must: spawning as a builder and getting 250-400 wood in less than 5 seconds is ok for laying doors, fast platforms, blocking enemy paths etc. Yeah, nothing new actually, but important imo. Moreover, I suggest making the columns that keep the tree-fall vertical at least 3 tiles up: sometimes the lag makes it not coincide with a vertical fall if you have 1 block only (check the image on 2nd)

    2nd. I thought of something like this for the shops at base:

    base idea1.png

    Nothing has to be 100% as shown, but the idea under this:
    All the team change to builder everytime they spawn, they get 100 wood and 30 stone, they drop it at the Storage (placed close to the tent for that), then change class at the shops.

    If everybody does it when they spawn, they might lose a bit of time, but their economy will be much better and the builder will manage to have around 2x or 3x the amount of mats. I think just changing class twice at the tent might also do the trick, as the mats will remain at it.

    3rd. Don't hesitate to place ladders for a better navigation inside your own base. As I see it, most of the times, if you don't have a proper path up, you'll be in more disadvantage: that situation when an enemy gets to your roofs and you can't attack him properly. Even at front walls, why not?:

    base idea3.png
    (The front wall is at the left)

    Don't be really afraid of placing ladders at front walls, if you have doors a bit pushed out, platforms, or spikes, that's not really a threat. It's like saying to the enemies "hey, i got some ladders, get on them to get hurt"; climbing on a wall with spikes gives you a hard time. Plus, if an enemy is on your ladder trying to destroy that door, he will surely hit the ladder first.

    4th. Simple spikes placement. From my point of view, making badass traps on cw is not a good idea: they get destroyed really fast and rob you some precious time. Spikes are not usually meant to instakill, but to steal some health and to scare the players a bit: "if you get here you will get hurt". Sometimes, a combination of wood/dirt block + spike + team trapblock works great:

    base idea2.png
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2014
    hierbo, SirDangalang, Joiken and 14 others like this.
  2. AmestriStephen

    AmestriStephen Bison Rider Forum Moderator Staff Alumni Tester

    Nice tutorial, those are some kind of basic building advices(for competitive scene).
    Well done.
  3. mcrifel

    mcrifel Bison Rider Staff Alumni Tester
    1. MIST

    Pretty good tutorial I must say!
  4. Ricket

    Ricket Shipwright Staff Alumni
    1. Ethereal Legion- ETHER

    I like the idea of the tiny, annoying hindering traps like the spike on dirt with one trap block. It minimises the risk of losing a trap and the enemy gaining an advantage, whilst maximising the amount of frustration and interruption enemies will face :thumbs_up:

    (Bring back [YB])
    hierbo and 101i like this.
  5. 8x

    8x Elimination Et Choix Traduisant la Realité Forum Moderator Tester Official Server Admin
    1. The Young Blood Collective - [YB]

    I don't aim for this to be a tutorial, just a thread to share simple ideas, don't take the op as something that must be done like it's shown.
    Attacking the 2nd point, yday we did some trainings and that simply had no place inside the chaos of the round. Perhaps changing to builder once you spawn and changing back to knight or archer is better.
  6. Dargona1018

    Dargona1018 Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Damnit, 8x, I was just about to go try out a way to be able to easily have Builders get mats via storage cache for NECRO.... Now I gotta steal yours... :>:(:
  7. StarskyGianni

    StarskyGianni Shipwright

    Tired of archers who climb your towers and who bomb your flag protection?
    Starsky is proud to present to you : the A.S.S. :B): (Archer Security System™).
    Works 100%. Easy to build. Easy to repair. Not very expensive. But very useful.


    You can replace pink platforms with stone and blue platforms with trapblocks to avoid that it burns.
    However, do not put stone blocks instead of wood blocks, or if not, archers will have time to climb... :rektlord:
    AngelOfDeeath, Psiklaw, 8x and 2 others like this.
  8. Dargona1018

    Dargona1018 Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Gotta say, as an archer myself, I truly don't see an easy solution with this.

    It would take a lot of time and precision to actually get over that, more than what would be given at any time during a clanwar, or even a regular match.
    hierbo likes this.
  9. Verzuvius

    Verzuvius Shark Slayer

    Blue_Tiger likes this.
  10. dayleaf

    dayleaf Haxor
    1. The Thieves Guild

    Gotta love the name, lol
    trying to climb that requires too much skill , it would be a *pun* pain in the ass *pun*, but it has weakpoints for both fire and bomb arrows.
    1: in the angle where doors and the platforms facing down ends, a bomb arrow and the platforms will fall and a hole of 2 blocks will be made.
    2: fire arrow on the door.
    3: bomb arrow in any of the side facing wall.
    but climbing for yourself its almost impossible.
    Hard to climb, cheap and easy to make.
  11. Aurora-

    Aurora- Shopkeep Stealer

    Heh try again pls :rekt:

  12. StarskyGianni

    StarskyGianni Shipwright

    thumbs down pls
    norill and BlueLuigi like this.
  13. 8x

    8x Elimination Et Choix Traduisant la Realité Forum Moderator Tester Official Server Admin
    1. The Young Blood Collective - [YB]

    Hah that's anyway better than the average platform wall though, and unless there's no enemies around it's not so easy to bypass.

    Edit to not doublepost:

    Regarding climbing an enemy tower, the common thing is to spam ladders. I saw kittycity doing something different at a point: up-facing platforms instead of ladders. 1-2 bombs can destroy all those 4 ladders, and blues slashing as well, the platforms have more durability, but are not as fast to climb.


    Some ideas on door-placing as well: not stacking them together to absorb explosions better:

    Normal/logic door placement (1 bomb arrow would open that):

    normal doors.png

    Wider placement (it could resist some better, specially the 3rd example, archers can shoot from inside and knights have some advantage):

    wide doors.png

    Post your ideas and examples guys! with images if possible.
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2014
  14. SAcptm

    SAcptm Bison Rider Staff Alumni

    I've long been a quiet advocate of the irregular door thing, and I regularly yell at bow over TS to abuse spawn mats for me. The rest of it is pretty much new to me (to my shame) and there's some really good ideas there. Gonna shamelessly steal these.
    hierbo and norill like this.
  15. Monsteri

    Monsteri Slower Than Light Tester

    Where is the cancer tower??
  16. 8x

    8x Elimination Et Choix Traduisant la Realité Forum Moderator Tester Official Server Admin
    1. The Young Blood Collective - [YB]

  17. BillyWeedman

    BillyWeedman Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Imho this would be the best setup for shops


    Building underground is very useful since dirt can absorb dmg from explosions. It is specially useful in these maps with a lot of stone right under the tent, so you can mine it and use the space for shops. A single builder can build the essentials fastly.

    I used sandbox btw, thats why you cant see the tent
    StarskyGianni likes this.
  18. SAcptm

    SAcptm Bison Rider Staff Alumni

    The problem with that for clanwars is the delay it causes each player to go down and buy their stuff before heading to the front. Also, the amount of extra time it takes to dig out the space in the build phase where you could be doing something else.
    StarskyGianni, Kububv and Juaro like this.
  19. kittycity

    kittycity Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Dargona1018 likes this.
  20. Boea

    Boea Such Beta

    COuld've been the Community Trap that everyone loves, Kitty!