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ADVENTURE or KAGCraft

Discussion in 'Modding [KAG]' started by Aphelion, Jan 9, 2014.

  1. Boea

    Boea Such Beta

    Messages:
    653
    The sandbox map is not generated, and is in fact the same each time.
    As far as we know, the screenshots are of generated maps, or at the very least, maps that are not the sandobox map.
     
  2. Aphelion

    Aphelion Wunderkind Donator
    1. Aphelion's Roleplay

    Messages:
    180
    It is a randomly generated map, and what do Airships have to do with Sandbox?
     
  3. Aphelion

    Aphelion Wunderkind Donator
    1. Aphelion's Roleplay

    Messages:
    180
    I'm sorry, but you aren't making any sense. I asked what Airships have to do with Sandbox. English does not seem to be your first language.
     
  4. Boea

    Boea Such Beta

    Messages:
    653
    Since I don't believe this is going to go anywhere, but it's a non-sequitor.
    They are wondering how you got the airship in Singleplayer, and something about only seeing airships being spawned on a vanilla server...

    Stella, you can spawn things in Singleplayer if you set sv_test to 1 in the console.
    What you saw on the server was an admin spawning things in because the server owner, or some super admin set sv_test to 1.
    As far as I know, which was in the times before seclevs, if sv_test were set to 1, anyone on the server could spawn things.

    What I definitely know is that mods only modify, and add onto the base functionality of the game.
    This means that you could probably spawn things in on most modded servers in KAG, given sv_test is set to 1


    Anyways, this is grossly off topic, but it's just faster to nip this in the bud. :v
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2014
  5. ZeroZ30o

    ZeroZ30o Bison Rider

    Messages:
    119
    In most of your posts, your English is not that good either, so don't be sayin' stuff about bad English please.
    Offtopic aside... why exactly are you doing this? Where's the fun? Terraria's mining is the shitiest thing ever. Minecraft's is passable, at least.
    And really, the way I see it, this is just RP with randomly generated maps.
    "Crafting" is alredy in, btw. 200 wood 100 stone for, say, a catapult, definitely sounds like crafting to me.
     
    Hella likes this.
  6. ZeroZ30o

    ZeroZ30o Bison Rider

    Messages:
    119
    Oh boy, you put alot of effort into that post. Since I don't give a damn, I'll just do a quickie:
    Your goals don't sound fun.
    I said "the way I see it", which makes it an opinion. And, really, tell me Terraria mining is fun, go ahead.
    "your English is horrid" when I only made one typo mistake, 10/10.
    "Music from Minecraft and core game improvements." A mod, on a server, based on Minecraft, on a map that will eventually have to be reset due to the RAM blobs create. Alternatively, you could not give a damn about people with not-so-good PCs, but even then, the server will HAVE to reset at one point, and from my experience in modded Minecraft when it updates, that is not fun.

    Done wasting my time here. Yey.
    Edit: Oh and thanks for ignoring all my points anyhow. Should've crossed the whole text :P.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2014
  7. ZeroZ30o

    ZeroZ30o Bison Rider

    Messages:
    119
    I'm proud of you.
    And as usual: "Oh and thanks for ignoring all my points anyhow. Should've crossed the whole text :P."

    Edit: Structure? Bitch please, I have logic.
     
  8. Hella

    Hella The Nightmare of Hair Global Moderator Donator Tester

    Messages:
    1,655
    Ladies, ladies! Don't get your knickers in a twist. Opinions are a perfectly valid thing to present, and are even better when responded to without unnecessary venom.
    Aphelion, if you don't want your threads to be full of arguments, then treat the people who come to discuss their content like the are functional persons. It really helps if you answer their questions, rather than simply piling on the bile. If you did that, people might start treating you with more respect in response.

    e: Personally, I'd like to see a mod such as this presented in a more enjoyable fashion than some previous examples of such goals, and I look forwards to experiencing the outcome, good or bad, first hand.
     
    Klokinator likes this.
  9. Aphelion

    Aphelion Wunderkind Donator
    1. Aphelion's Roleplay

    Messages:
    180
    My vision for the project will be fun. I don't know why you have such a negative view. Who doesn't want an RPG like game mode?

    Your mention of me having bad English is quite random, unnecessary and irrelevant. Especially because I did not directly say "Your English is bad", I simply said "English does not seem to be your first language".
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2014
    Hella and Klokinator like this.
  10. Boea

    Boea Such Beta

    Messages:
    653
    So, what do you think about my allusion to Expeditions: Conquistador? (in terms of teching, and tech rot)
    How about Kid Icarus for the 3DS? (In terms of difficulty/challenge)

    I can reiterate, or digress them.
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2014
  11. ZeroZ30o

    ZeroZ30o Bison Rider

    Messages:
    119
    Well, I find it wouldn't be fun since you're (imo) taking the least fun part of games like terraria.
    This is only from what I've read, if you're gonna add bosses or gameplay stuff, that'd change it.
    Otherwise, I just see it as a slow RP server with huge maps.

    Edit: your quote of me in your last post is changed, what's up with that?
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2014
  12. YouPoppedMyBalloon

    YouPoppedMyBalloon Catapult Fodder

    Messages:
    23
    @Aphelion3371 Please don't take offence to any of this. It's only constructive criticism.

    I agree with the prior statements of the uncanny similarity of this and roleplay. Personally, the only way I can see this as being significantly different is if no races were included and the game was made single player. However, even then I can't help but feel that such a concept is redundant. Assuming that almost every person in the KAG community has played a game like Minecraft or Terarria before, a game mode such as this wouldn't make much sense to play when they can just play the game that the concept of this mod is based off of. In no way do I think an adventurous twist on KAG is a bad idea. In fact, it sounds like it could have a lot of potential. However, I think that the direction you're taking on this mod is somewhat misguided. Perhaps instead of a Minecraft-like adventure, you could take it in the direction that the developers did on single player missions, setting a simple goal for the player on each stage, leading up to a conclusion like the last level in which you save the princess. (if you haven't played these missions before, try it. See what I mean.) This could easily be accomplished with a custom map cycle in the order of the stages that cycles when the player completes the stages objective.
    In the end, it's up to you how to make your own mod, but you may find more success taking the path less traveled by, to put it metaphorically.
     
    ZeroZ30o likes this.
  13. Boea

    Boea Such Beta

    Messages:
    653
    My question to the above is, "Where do you come off when you say this mod, let alone vanilla single player is very similar to either of those games?"

    Kag is very far from either, and this mod tries to expand upon the single player experience of kag. Adding in features that negate the fast-paced (ie agile, combatative, active) nature of Kag would be outright.
    What you see is not representative of the future path of the mod. And at the very most, this is a third-party reimplementation of the removed/broken map generator.

    You cannot say for certain that you dislike the direction of the mod because it hasn't added anything contentious yet. Unless you find map gen to be a feature that you are scornful of.


    I'm not at a computer , so my coherence and thought process are immensely dampened.
    But believe me, y'all are jumping the fucking gun here. Also, if you like challenge mode, or save the princess mode so much, just ask a modder to make more levels for you; it is clear that Aphelion doesn't want to do that.
     
  14. Birthcurse

    Birthcurse Builder Stabber

    Messages:
    2
    Nah, leave that to terraria and starbound, if they added more dungeons like the Wizard's Castle, it would be great, but open world sandbox? Kag is different from those games, Just cause its pixelated (I love the 16-bits style) and you can break and place things it doesn't means its exactly like Terraria or Minecraft.
     
    101i, YouPoppedMyBalloon and ZeroZ30o like this.
  15. YouPoppedMyBalloon

    YouPoppedMyBalloon Catapult Fodder

    Messages:
    23
    I'm saying the complete opposite, you must've misunderstood. I was stating that vanilla single player is different and used it as an example for Aphelion to take his mod in the direction of. Only a random suggestion, not a request. However, I did in fact state that KAGCraft is extremely similar to Terraria and Minecraft because, well, it is. The goal is to mine, build, and survive, its an adventure game, and the name even has "Craft" in it. I'm not trying to say this is a rip-off, I'm only saying that the idea of this mod seems to be going the way of redundancy. I also put in no input as to whether I like or dislike this mod before. Granted, I think it seems repetitive, however I would first play it before coming to a consensus of whether I like it or not. You should read a bit more carefully. :]
     
  16. Boea

    Boea Such Beta

    Messages:
    653
    No, you are still jumping the gun on the path of the mod.
    Something to work for would be Alpha Zombie Fortress, with some normalcy, or control even, on the spawn rates.
    Sure it is a lot like Minecraft, and Terraria, but combat actually made sense, and was an integral part to survival. In either of those games, it's trivial when you make a box, and unwieldy when you expose yourself.
    Building also comes to play because fortifications are needed to actually help you with abating the sheer hordes of mobs who can very much destroy them. However, in either game goes, a box of dirt is good enough; in Kag, you need to have layers of stone, adequate lighting, secured quarters, and choke points to funnel the monsters into a kill zone, and away from your precious belongings.

    What I'm suggesting, especially when it comes to teching/rotting/challenging, is building towards Alpha's Zombie Fortress.
    Something that really isn't fair to call minecraft or terraria.

    Challenge, and Save the Princess are their own damn thing, and do it very well; we don't need to add another log on that fire.
     
    Stella-Jim likes this.
  17. YouPoppedMyBalloon

    YouPoppedMyBalloon Catapult Fodder

    Messages:
    23
    I have said twice before that Save the Princess was only an example and I'm not actually suggesting or requesting it. It's kind of annoying having to repeat myself. Also, I could literally flip your point of how we don't need more of Challenge or Save the Princess, as my prior statements have been saying that we don't need more of the same thing. Also, your requesting we go in the direction of zombie mode, something that is already its own thing as well. You're not really making much sense.
     
  18. Boea

    Boea Such Beta

    Messages:
    653
    Zombie mode is not working properly, and that is an important thing to keep note of why.
    If you want your single player adventure, you are going to need mobs, something to fight.
    Beta Zombies (representative of Beta Mobs, small and large, weak and strong) should be able to show you why it is honestly bullshit, and why Alpha Zombies are something to build towards. In Beta, they are overly agile (Wraiths worst so), overly mobile, they climb walls instantaneously; when grouped up them make tornadoes; you can't reasonably approach them because of how they are constantly attacking (hair-trigger keg wraiths), and it gets more painfully obvious in groups; because of their constant chewing, they also constantly melt through any structure. All in all, it just makes fighting them a bad experience, which is against the grain of what KAG is about, being able to combat things.
    Compare this to Alpha: you can slightly outpace the zombies (But not skeletons, Wraiths thankfully can't zoom across the map); the skeletons can't instantly zoom up walls; all of these units don't jump to a height of about 5b; they need a surface to ladder up against, and no they can't do the strange trampoline thing that beta mobs do; combat is more feasible because they only attack based on two criteria (target in melee range, as opposed to always, or anger timer ticks off; it seems the beta npc knights have this sort of pattern, and fighting them is pretty good); they more slowly destroy walls, and back walls (they only get the strength to destroy walls when their anger timer ticks off, zombies do 1 damage, zk flail about for a bit. There is friendly fire between zombies, so in groups they actually slowly decay, and you don't get a map that isn't covered in them); lastly, no keg-wraiths, there is nothing worse than having an almost guaranteed death, and getting a huge portion of your wall nuked when 3 of them spawn on each edge a night.
    So building a wall does indeed matter a lot against them, they can't quickly bore holes through it, and they can't instantly vault over it; they only really do it when there are no players around and they group up, and their anger timer ticks off and purposely destroy their surroundings or pillar up. As a result of this you can actually prep a small fighting area that doesn't degrade every night, and you can withstand a few holes in the barricade without the tower coming crashing down. When it comes to fighting them, it always seems like an option, even when they come in groups; the skeletons and zombies are basic mobs, and they can't overwhelm you or your base as they do in the Beta Mod. They can still press you to retreat, but that's not because there are 5 of them, and they are spamming their attack out of sync which could probably kill you then and there, or when they glitchily attack you even when they are down, just after you knock them down.
    And don't make a comparison with the wisten, and sharks, they aren't reasonable things to be put up against unless you have them wedged because they are actually supposed to be large obstacles that slow down rushing, and be environmental tools. Zombies are things that are supposed to be fought against.


    As opposed to Alpha Zombie Fortress, the suggestion I made of challenging, teching, and rotting mechanics generally seek to tailor the difficulty to what the player can handle, or pleases. This also means that the difficulty curve doesn't naturally increase with time, but with commitment to do so. If a player fails, and dies repeatedly, this does mean that the player will suffer consequences (equipment rot/etc), and they have to take time to recuperate until the difficulty gradually rots to a level that they can handle.
    This should allow people that want to build the chance to do so, and fight against small threats only, and it would allow others to dive straight in, or take a bit of time to prepare themselves.

    And the magical phrase of the day is that, "For this mode to be taken seriously in the context of Kag, the threats [mobs/etc] need to be there, but also surmountable."
     
    Stella-Jim and ZeroZ30o like this.
  19. YouPoppedMyBalloon

    YouPoppedMyBalloon Catapult Fodder

    Messages:
    23
    If you have complaints about Beta zombies, you should post these points on a social forum where acceptable in zombie server forums such as Beo's. What you what isn't KAGcraft, you want Alpha zombies, which this is not. You make great points and by no means are you incorrect, but you're barking up the wrong tree.
     
    ZeroZ30o likes this.
  20. Boea

    Boea Such Beta

    Messages:
    653
    Zombie Alpha is supposed to be unsustainable. There would be no point to add in teching, and stat rot there.

    Other than that, problems with Mobs/Monsters in general affect all efforts to use them.
    So bringing up the comparison matters. As far as game modes go, it's pretty cut and dry.

    Anyways, I can explain the Challenge/Tech/Rot Mechanics over pm's via "Conversations", if you want.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2014
    Stella-Jim likes this.