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Archer Balance [371]

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by allknowingfrog, May 3, 2012.

?

The archer...

  1. is already well-balanced.

    31.9%
  2. is over-powered.

    23.3%
  3. needs adjustment, but is not over-powered.

    44.8%
  1. TheFilip

    TheFilip Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Messages:
    204
    Isn't it ironic that in every game there's atleast one balance issue with a sniper class?
     
  2. MCrypa

    MCrypa Haxor

    Messages:
    562
    Exactly, cause it counters idiots. (Noobs, w.e)
     
  3. One

    One I got 99 problems and my name is One Donator Tester

    Messages:
    641
    What? :huh?:
     
  4. Ne3zy

    Ne3zy Shark Slayer

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    308
    Archers shoots faster than a fcking PKM :>:(:

    [​IMG]

    Do you think an archer was able to kill a knight if he was at 2 meters from him in real life ?
    No he was not, archers are made for long range combat not for short range, when an archer is next to a knight he have to die that's all except if the knight is a nab.
    I'm not a noob knight but remimber that archers can arrow spam without decreasing their speed futhermore they can easily climb on a tree.
    In return knights lose speed when attacking and lose also their protection. This makes archers overpowered like rambo is :up: !

    Sorry for my bad english, just balance classes :rollseyes:
     
    SARGRA13, Riletyface and Beelzebub like this.
  5. AnRK

    AnRK Shark Slayer

    Messages:
    641
    Not many are saying archers are horrifically overpowered, and certainly not as individuals, the problem is groups of archers guarding towers, especially on open plains. All people really want is some way of either softening the effect of the horde or the cover they hide in. I agree that the tactic doesn't always work to mob up archers in towers and defend, however those are situations where the archers in question are complete retards/don't know what they're doing for some other reason, or the tower is badly designed. The whole "they have a shield lolz :huh?:" argument makes literally no sense either, a shield does literally nothing when your up against 3 archers with a bit of sense, or a mob of a shit load with none, stun damage, stun damage dead.

    Alot of people are also suggesting making the archer BETTER too as well as nerfing some elements and changing some not directly archer related stuff to sort out this particular issue, but the only times this sort of thing isn't an issue is when you playing on a server without a great deal of people on, or one where everyone's thick as pig shit, and 1 semi sharp builder can ruin the defensive capability of every tower with a few ladders and a few stone blocks while the other team doesn't know what to do.
     
    Contrary likes this.
  6. TheFilip

    TheFilip Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Messages:
    204
    If every single person is complaining about something, then there might be something wrong with you, not them.
     
    allknowingfrog likes this.
  7. DawnOfNights

    DawnOfNights Shopkeep Stealer

    Messages:
    83


    While you are at the real life thing, how is it possible for 1 builder wearing nothing but a cloth over his body to carry 250 cubic meters of both wood, gold and stone?
    How can he place them instantly, without the need of cement or other utilities?!?

    How can a knight break solid stone with a sword? It isnt very possible if you ask me.
    Bombjumping and blocking bombs by using a shield is agains the laws of physics, so is the fact that an entire building could be held up by a back wall

    Speaking of which, why is this game 2d, i mean, if it was supposed to be real, it would need to be in a 3d enviroment.

    [​IMG]
     
    MCrypa and SARGRA13 like this.
  8. Ne3zy

    Ne3zy Shark Slayer

    Messages:
    308
    My argument is not invalid, in fact my argument was not that it's impossible in real life, that was just an example.
    My argument is that archers are made for long range combat (and if you tell me the contrary you are pretty idiot) and they should not kill a knight who is made for close combat when they are close to him.
    I think this is logical, at least for me...
     
  9. TheFilip

    TheFilip Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Messages:
    204
    The solution is simple:
    Archers now need to fully charge the crossair to shoot an arrow.
     
  10. Sarmane

    Sarmane Go Tau'va yourself San Diego. Donator

    Messages:
    96
    i think the reality point really hits there- there can be no other feasible way for an arrow to be projected by a bow without it being at either full or signicant drawback from the archers bow..... other words- archers need to be slower (still strong in numbers) shooters-

    i think you have just solved the whole issue D:

    @ Rayne- completly forgot about archer climbing :p good point, like the server mod idea, when server is working again will try it out
     
  11. Rayne

    Rayne ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ Administrator Global Moderator Forum Moderator Tester

    Messages:
    1,916
    That's retarded, if you can't shoot an arrow without charging to full, then you couldn't arrowclimb, and arrow climbing is a very fun and rewarding feature if you can get good at it.

    Why not just remove damage from arrow's lowest charge? this is possible for server owners right now, it stops the spam, still allows arrow climbing, and encourages at least halfway charged arrows.

    Could also lower mid charge damage if that was really a problem too.
     
  12. Ne3zy

    Ne3zy Shark Slayer

    Messages:
    308
    This is what we have to do
     
  13. Fate

    Fate Studying seashells

    Messages:
    593
    I would prefer having 0-damage/0-stun arrows when firing from the gray charge and lower damage from the mid-charge arrows than only be forced to fire full-charged arrows. That way the low-charge arrows can still be used to feign shooting damaging arrows and confuse the enemy.
     
  14. MCrypa

    MCrypa Haxor

    Messages:
    562
    True that, but define "Close" cause if an archer is standing right next to a knight and the knight dies, then the knight has to be pretty retarded.

    And

    Your last statement that an archer should not be able to kill a knight short range: Encourages camping = Complaining about camping.
     
    DawnOfNights likes this.
  15. Kouji

    Kouji Cold, Uncaring, Sadistic, Evil and Cruel Meanie Administrator Global Moderator Forum Moderator Tester
    1. MOLEing Over Large Estates - [MOLE]
    2. REKINS OF SEAS: Super Crew of Ultimate Havoking 2: Return of King of KAG: Chapter 420blazeit - REKIN

    Messages:
    2,910
    I personally hate servers where the lowest shot arrow doesn't do damage, mainly because I can't shoot arrows without going to at least a mid charge which takes forever. It forces me to become more passive with my arrow shooting and eventually on those servers I just end up camping. It's just not that fun playing archer like that.

    To me it's kind of a bad way to solve the problem.
    Currently, the charge bar basically works like this, you can shoot at anytime, and your arrow will do damage depending on which zone you are in.
    currently.png
    ^ people shoot their arrows around here when they are spamming, I'll admit that I do it sometimes as well, particularly if I've got more than one knight on me.
    :blank: ^ I usually shoot around here in cqc, because arrow spam is useless against a knight and it's only reasonable to shoot them when they are open to an attack.
    Because of this, I am completely unable to shoot an arrow to damage to someone when they leave themselves defenseless, so they don't take any damage. This makes me useless in helping friendly knights because it takes forever to get to a yellow or red charged arrow when I'm helping them and by the time I do, either most of my teammates, or most of the enemy is dead and I provided little help to no help.

    If you changed the charge bar to something like this:
    shouldbe.png
    and made it so that you couldn't shoot in the black area, You'd end up preventing arrow spamming and still allowing archers to shot somewhat fast but useful arrows.
     
    killatron46, SARGRA13, Madoka and 4 others like this.
  16. Ne3zy

    Ne3zy Shark Slayer

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    308
    Good idea, futhermore archers have to get slowed while shooting.
     
  17. MCrypa

    MCrypa Haxor

    Messages:
    562
    Um... I rarely play as archer, but don't they become slowed while charging anymore?
    Think you meant this, as a "shot" lasts like 0.1 sec.
     
  18. Ne3zy

    Ne3zy Shark Slayer

    Messages:
    308
    I mean that they will be slowed like 0.5s after shooting
     
  19. MCrypa

    MCrypa Haxor

    Messages:
    562
    Oh... Well, that's a good idea.
    But one thing is to imagine what will happen, and another is what it actually will do.
     
  20. AnRK

    AnRK Shark Slayer

    Messages:
    641
    I thought there was already a null zone in charging where you didn't fire? I know it's not very long but still pretty sure there's a bit of charge time where if you release nothing happens, cos something got changed a few builds ago with it. I wouldn't mind it been increased a bit though, would help stop the rain of arrows a bit. There's so many things people have suggested now though I've lost track a bit, I think there should be plenty for the devs to mull over and to put into play testing cos I'd be surprised if they hadn't registered there was a problem with camping in towers by now...