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Archer Hiding

Discussion in 'Suggestions & Ideas' started by Zeus, Dec 19, 2013.

Mods: Rainbows
  1. Zeus

    Zeus Builder Stabber Donator

    Messages:
    10
    I would like to propose an idea to improve the archer's ability to hide: remove the archer's mini-map dot when crouching behind something (bush, tree, etc.). Thoughts?
     
    J-man2003 and Fernegulus like this.
  2. KaiserBolt

    KaiserBolt Catapult Fodder

    Messages:
    18
    I think when crouching in general would be good. It is a bit laughable how easy it is to spot archers playing dead.
     
  3. YES AND YOU CANT SEE THE NAME TOO
     
    TeQaS, Fernegulus, crackwise and 2 others like this.
  4. Landoo2

    Landoo2 Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Messages:
    186
    in my opinion hiding isnt that hard... grapple at a pine tree and hold right mouse button, so you hide in the tree, and your able to shoot, you can hide in gras too, but thats a bit ovious,... i always hide, if there is a combination of grass and a high bush, thats perfect, the bush hides your head and the grass hides the rest.. so thats my opinion
     
  5. Zeus

    Zeus Builder Stabber Donator

    Messages:
    10
    That's not the issue. I play knight almost exclusively and I find it incredibly easy to identify hiding archers because of their dot on the mini-map. I really like the idea of their dot becoming invisible any time they are crouching or behind something as mentioned by Kaiser.
     
    Fernegulus and epenow like this.
  6. Nivlac_13

    Nivlac_13 Shopkeep Stealer

    Messages:
    115
    By the power given to me by my grievous sins I bid this post to live again!
    Why was this never discussed further or acted on? It's an issue I just noticed after killed three archers by their dot on the minimap and the fact that laying archers look different from dead archers. Hiding should be much easier.
     
  7. SAcptm

    SAcptm Bison Rider Staff Alumni

    Messages:
    134
    I don't think the minimap is the main issue, I personally hardly ever look at it to check for enemies. However the archer's actual appearance on the screen does seem to make it much harder to hide in release KAG than it was in classic.

    One reason is that an archer can't stay completely stationary in the dense foliage of a tree like they could in classic, and another is that the image of a prone archer now sticks out like a sore thumb against the image of corpses, whereas they used to look quite similar. I agree that its a shame that this trick has sort of lost its viability, but I think it would be a very big ask to expect either of these mechanics/sprites to change for the sake of getting it back.

    Whatever we've lost in this change, however, we have gained the hilarious ability to trick unsuspecting players by carrying enemy corpses to hide our team colours and acting like a friendly around enemies. Archers are as capable of doing this as any other class so there is still room for innovation if you are willing to give it a go.
     
    J-man2003 and UnnamedPlayer like this.
  8. Trumbles

    Trumbles Bison Rider

    Messages:
    454
    You can still hide inside corpses, and the solution to tree hiding is to simply grapple it.

    I don't usually hide much as i'd rather have the attention of my enemies (unless they have an archer-heavy team and i want to catch a few off guard before a crapton of triple shots come my way), but these two methods are usually good enough for me when i need to.

    I wish tall grass was a bit... taller. Would make hiding in it viable. I agree that being removed from mini-map while prone would be a nice addition, however people rarely check it for enemies unless there's absolutely no action going on.
     
    epenow likes this.
  9. Duplolas

    Duplolas So Sad

    Messages:
    917
    Actually the idea of hiding in trees is not that simple. I brought it up in another thread about how archers have lost the ability to really "hide" in all trees. Since there are different types of trees, each one has a different "top branch" the highest spot you can be hanging from. There is only 1 tree if I am not mistaken that allows you to hang without being seen, the others you cannot hide in without spamming the up button.

    As for removing the dot for archer when they are hiding... it would be a cool concept. Use the same mechanics that are used in Assassin's Creed. Designate areas that if hiding in, your dot disappears, but when firing your dot shows up again.

    Areas that would work: Bushes, Tall Grass, the one Tree that you can hide in, and anything else that covers 3/4 or all of your body.
     
  10. Trumbles

    Trumbles Bison Rider

    Messages:
    454
    There are only two types of trees, Pines and Oaks. Pines are the ones you can effectively hide in.

    TBH i don't really understand why people even care about hiding though..
     
  11. Duplolas

    Duplolas So Sad

    Messages:
    917
    [​IMG]

    Archer hides. Knights, essentially the flag's only defense besides other archers, run past. Archer comes out from hiding. Archer steals flag.

    Essentially hiding allows archers to hide from the hordes of other knights killing everything in their path. Once they pass, you are home free to steal the flag since the knights are fighting behind you. If they die, you have a safe run all the way back to your base while they are respawning.

    So instead of how right now, archers have to work with knights to kill everyone on the field before attempting to grab the flag, they can now skip that, run right to the base and grab the flag.

    It is a strategy that has won me a game when playing as archer. It is really the only strategy I have when playing archer since I suck at aiming as him. It is the only major way I can actually help as archer.

    Of course, "I" can be replaced with "any new player" easily, since my skill with archer is that of a new player.
     
    J-man2003, Dargona1018 and Sir_Walter like this.
  12. Monsteri

    Monsteri Slower Than Light Tester

    Messages:
    1,916
    When you press S, your body should instantly gib and once you release, all the parts come back together.

    This is a much more believable form of playing dead.
     
    J-man2003, Ricket, Draco1991 and 14 others like this.
  13. Trumbles

    Trumbles Bison Rider

    Messages:
    454
    And then the knights turn around meaning you have to dodge several slash spammers while having gimped movespeed :P.

    Anyway i get the situations where it's really useful (Like playing CTF with bad builders), but i'd rather just kite all the knights around until my own knight wall moves up and catches them offguard, and each missing a heart or two :P
     
    Auburn likes this.
  14. I agree it is very easy to spot the archers when hiding only mainly because of there tag.

    When hiding behind another dead body though it does increase the odds of them not seeing you because you are basically hiding.

    But sometime I think they need to change the archers hiding skills because as builder and knight have forms of attacking on a 1v1 if there is no trees around how is the archer supposed to hide that's the main problem here.
     
  15. dayleaf

    dayleaf Ballista Bolt Thrower
    1. The Thieves Guild

    Messages:
    255
    i used the dead body tactic, you take a dead body and put it for cover your head, it was effective but sometimes i was killed anyway
     
    Invisibility likes this.
  16. Trumbles

    Trumbles Bison Rider

    Messages:
    454
    People tend to like gibbing bodies for no reason, so yeaaaah..
     
  17. Exactly that can be the inky problem in that.
     
  18. dayleaf

    dayleaf Ballista Bolt Thrower
    1. The Thieves Guild

    Messages:
    255
    i was thinking about a way to hide and move at sametime, like crouching and advancing, that should help a lot, it will be used to get enemy base without being seeked anytime you have to advance (sorry for bad english)
     
    Invisibility likes this.
  19. Humblar_Tabulu

    Humblar_Tabulu TURTLE Turtle turtle... Donator

    Messages:
    186
    I don't know much about archers, but I must say, I miss you Trumbles. :/
     
  20. orange_otter_01

    orange_otter_01 Drill Rusher

    Messages:
    75
    you cant just run and then duck and expect to stay hidden, sometimes when im being chased i jump into a hole or a mine or off a cliff and i ducked when i hit the ground so they think i must've died of fall damage and having half a heart then they leave me alone, simple if you only think about it::):

    --- Double Post Merged, Jan 25, 2014, Original Post Date: Jan 25, 2014 ---
    the
    enemy can see your quiver sticking out and since the quiver is coloured they say:

    hey its an archer KILL HIM:knight::knight::knight::knight::knight::knight::knight: :archer:

    then ur running for your life
     
    J-man2003 likes this.
Mods: Rainbows