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Archers or Ninjas

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Ratka, May 4, 2013.

  1. eamono

    eamono Arsonist

    when i said it was a pre-beta i meant that the "full release" of the beta isn't out yet, we are still in the silent beta, I wasn't saying "it's too unbalanced to be a real beta", KAB is still amazing and even after investing more then 8 hours into it so far it's still so much fun (except when some dumbass tries to un-box a boat in the middle of the base)
  2. Vaine

    Vaine Horde Gibber

    Let me ask you this, do you know what a beta is?
    Hella likes this.
  3. eamono

    eamono Arsonist

    yes i do, it's sort of like the prototype of what the finished product will be, except that this prototype already has most of the functionality of what it should do but there are a bunch of smaller things that need cleaning up. KAG classic was no-where near what the devs wanted KAG to be, KAB is alot closer to what the finished game will be like.

    And I know that "pre-betas" don't make sense and that you don't to pass a quality test to be officially "in beta"
  4. Galen

    Galen Haxor Staff Alumni Donator

    Apparently you're somewhat new to KAG. KAG's alpha was out for 2 years until the BETA came. And the logical step after alpha is beta. So stop discussing whether this is a beta in your eyes or not and get back to the topic.
    Vaine likes this.
  5. Ratka

    Ratka Shipwright

    That is good to hear, archers will be an actual support class then. I do hope that they leave the speed when drawing as without it they won't be any good unless they are hiding in towers or behind knight hordes. On another topic, why are you all fighting in this Thread?
  6. doomman117

    doomman117 Bison Rider
    1. Delta Force - Delta

    I just want archers to be a support class, maybe if they made the charge time a little less spammy then i am OK with that, just get rid of that damn backstab.
  7. As everyone else is saying, the archers 3 heart backstab is terribly OP. Also the fact of the matter is, that an archer has the capabilities of every single class in the game aside from building he can ruin buildings with fire arrows *buider*, he can do massive melee damage*knight*, and he obviously has the capabilities of a long ranged unit*archer*. Effectively making this the most overpowered class in the game.
  8. Crabmaster

    Crabmaster Bison Rider
    1. Zen Laboratories

    So fun thing I realized while playing today, on top of everything else, once archers get fire arrows they render knight's shields useless...as they seem to instantly pierce the shield and catch you fire, in some cases killing you. I'm just glad they can't use dril- wait...they can...uh...Well then(Also while on fire seems to mess with your ability to shield? probably from the damage? Not really all that important, just simply another click solves this.)
  9. Raelian

    Raelian Bison Rider

    I kinda dislike this whole mentality of "archer needs to be a support class", it's getting a bit annoying and I wish people would stop saying that. From the above mentioned I see that there are some features that make the archer pretty powerful (fire arrows passing through shield, no slowing down when charging shots and running etc.) and I understand that it is necessary to tone them down for balance but I don't understand why should the archer be the support class and the knight have all the glory just because that's how it's been in alpha.

    The only reason archer was a support class in alpha was because the knight was the most mobile class, could instant gib any other class with a bomb, jump the highest and pretty much own an archer 1v1 without much of a sweat unless the knight was a complete noob, while the archer was forced to sit in the back and rely on a wall of knights or stone in order to survive or run around, spam arrows like crazy and hope the knight wasn't able to shield them in time.

    I want to see archers hold their own in a fight, even if their backstab/fire arrows gets nerfed I'd really wish to see an archer being a viable class for battle without having to always rely on a knight and maybe even be able to take on a knight 1v1 and win.

    At best, I'd advice lowering the backstab's damage to 2 hearts if a nerf is in order, but I'm against removing it.
    NinjaCell likes this.
  10. Beelzebub

    Beelzebub Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Archers can easily outfight, outrange, and evade knights. They're overpowered. When they are winning melee fights against knights on a regular basis, something isn't right. That isn't even taking into consideration the rapidity of their fire nor the speed at which they move with a drawn bow.
    Exid, Ej and Vaine like this.
  11. Lord_bugg

    Lord_bugg Smashing Donator

    I disagree, as an archer it is difficult to outfight a knight, from the front stab only does 1/4 hearts, knight jab does 1. Also knights can shield while archers cant making them much more vulnerable. The only way to win is to get behind and backstab twice, a very difficult feat if your opponent turns.
    This rarely happens ind it is normally down to mistake of the knight rather than power of the archer
    well of course they can, theyre a ranged class :rollseyes:
    yes, they can, but they have to able to avoid damage/attacks.
    The rapidity of their fire is to compensate for reduced range, rapid fire isnt really a problem on war servers as anyone going close to an archer should expect to be shot and take precautions. On a TDM server rapid fire is sometimes very annoying.
    I agree that this should be lowered. But slighty, not loads, just slightly.
    NinjaCell and Vaine like this.
  12. Beelzebub

    Beelzebub Ballista Bolt Thrower

    Knights have ranged weapons: bombs. The current version of them sucks.
  13. Lord_bugg

    Lord_bugg Smashing Donator

    Yes, but they were never intended to be able to out perform archers ranged weapons were they? However, knights bmbs are very effective against archers as even though they move fast they cant outrun a bomb blast.
  14. ParaLogia

    ParaLogia tired Administrator Global Moderator Forum Moderator Tester Official Server Admin

    It's not right to compare archer knifing to knight jabs.

    Jabs are ridiculously slow in beta, especially compared to the new movement speed. The knife takes virtually no time compared to that. It seemed like the range for the knife is somewhat larger too, which makes absolutely no sense. (Might just be lag, so don't quote me on that.) :huh?:
    In addition, it's harder to place a jab because of directional jabbing, while the knife still has only 2 directions.

    The 3-heart backstab is even more outrageous, because once again, it takes no time to charge. A knight's double slash (which is also very hard to place so that both slashes hit) can do 1.33 times more damage, but it also takes 20 times longer to charge. In the time it takes a knight to charge even a single slash, any archer will have put several arrows through him already.
  15. I agree with logia and beezle. An archer can dominate every class and defense that you could make. He can climb towers via arrows or trees, he can burn things now from fire arrows/satchels he can dominate in melee, alongside of his ranged capabilities and increased shield break time from his arrows. Altogether this class can play the role of every other class in the game currently.

    *edit* Also they are the most nimble class, making them harder to hit. they removed bow draw speed decrease. making them nearly impossible to catch as a knight. and the knights jab time has been INCREASED making it that much harder to hit that running archer dumping arrows into your poor knights face.
  16. Rainbows

    Rainbows KAG Guard Forum Moderator Tester
    1. The Young Blood Collective - [YB]

    I keep thinking if everyone here is playing the same game.
    In my experience it is usually easy to kill archers with a bomb, or more often injure them to an extent they take no chances and run away.
    I've always found it quite easy to keep them out of knifing distance but close enough to jab if the attempt to shoot me till i charge a slash or two.
    The issue of them wielding drills shouldn't be an issue. A single slash will take them out and the drill would overheat unless the archer is in water (which is the drills fault, not the archers).
    Fire can easily be stopped by water buckets or maybe even STONE.
    Considering only 5 fire arrows can be held letting them bypass shields is fine with me.
    NinjaCell and Lord_bugg like this.
  17. Lord_bugg

    Lord_bugg Smashing Donator

    They cant, a stone wall with an overhang created by a builder can stop them. A knight with a bomb or whos good at shielding then stabbing or slashing can stop them.
    Most trees are gone by the time you get archers and other classes attacking in full swing so they wont be able to climb that way. As Rainbows said, fire arrows are limited in number and availability so they are difficult to use effectively and any wel made base or organised team can stop a fire. they can only climb certain towers (mainly those with out overhangs) and while theyre doing so they are an easy target for your teams archers or fall traps.
    No. Archers do not dominate melee. Their backstab ability is powerful but is difficult to pull off when fighting knights as you have to be able to get behind them without them turning,stabbing, shielding, lighting a bomb, or being halped by another knight or archer. If an archer approaches a knight and only uses melee 9/10 times they are killed.
    I agree with you here, archers should be slowed slightly as they charge but iff you chase with your shield up as a knight you can eventualy back an archer into a corner where you can then kill him. Or you can throw a bomb at him as he runs, fast as they are, they can outrun bombs.
    You know, i never knew archers could build forts or factories or mine gold or stone! Please tell me how to do theses things as an archer.
  18. Hello, my name is L. Obbing and the friends of mine here are called Runningaway Frombombs, Tre E. Climbing and Ceil Ing-Climbing.
    a) It's nearly impossible for a knight to keep shielding/dodging BOTH the possibility of being shank'd and shot as he has to turn around like crazy to even get a slight chance of jabbing that tree monkey
    b) You can carry 1 bomb and an archer has to be mentally challenged not to run away upon seeing it.
    c) Good job on implying that the archer is ok because he can lose 1v2.
    16th likes this.
  19. Beelzebub

    Beelzebub Ballista Bolt Thrower

    yo bro there's a class that's great at killing archers

    it's called the archer class and it owns
  20. makmoud98

    makmoud98 You are already DEAD Forum Moderator Staff Alumni Tester

    I think the archers are fine the way they are except the back-stab, the back-stab need to be changed to just 1.5 hearts not 3. With a bomb you can easily kill an archer. :)