Class Bawww/Argument thread

I'm pretty tired of instakill bombs myself, but even as a builder there's a lot you can do to dodge them, especially if you're a good actor. You can pull off a lot of stupid shit as builder if you can disguise your intentions, in regards to bomb jumping this can be applied by running away and giving the impression you're panicked so that the enemy knights think that you will be moving in a predictable trajectory and take steps to account for movement, then as they about to throw you start running towards them. You'll probably still take a tonne of damage, but you'll live. One time I've done this and used the blast to ghetto bomb jump through the air and hammer a fool on landing.

 

PROMOTE STEALTHY ARCHER CLASS
https://forum.kag2d.com/threads/changing-archer-to-a-stealth-based-class.2557/
~still thinks archers should be able to fall greater distances
also for some reason im been surviving those bombs as close range, just by jumping


X3





something like that

 

If the knight is stupid and throws the bomb right when he lights it you can grab it and throw that bomb right back at him at the right time and kill him xD...i used and to many times =/

 

The reason I think archers are strong is that they have potentially unlimited range. Knight's bombs have fuses limiting the distance they can go. Archers can shoot down and it will fall forever until it hits something, and still do damage.

 

I got this crazy idea, let's promote this thing called teamplay by allowing knight's shields to block bomb blasts. Maybe then we might see archers and builders actually leave their stupid camper towers, and charge along with the knights.

Why would I leave the safety of my tower if no-matter what, that one effortless bomb can kill me?

 

i dont understand

can we also make bombs objects, because that too will be really cool.. and ... and could we do group bomb jumps (jump in air at the same, fly with knight

 

Well, I built thread on class balance with suggestions and it was insta killed by admins.
Here you go.

Currently the balance of the classes on KAG is favorable toward the knight.​

Let's look at each class and see why I say that: (all numbers taken from experience in game on different servers - feel free to correct me if there is an official file)​

Knight​

- deal massive damage with charged slash​

- deal (1 heart) medium damage, quickly and repetitively​

- deal massive damage in AOE with bomb (6 blocks open air, insta kill)​

- slowly destroy player placed blocks with slash​

- destroy lots of player placed blocks with bomb​

- block all incoming damage from 180 degrees with shield​

- glide with shield across gaps​

- bomb jump large distances​

- shield slam for massive damage​

- negate fall damage with glide​

- jump 4 blocks with slash​

- has most health in game​

Just to sum up Knight is #1 in HP, #1 in damage dealt, and a close #2 in block removal (the only thing a knight can't do is build)​

Builder​

- deals (0.5 heart) small damage, repetitively​

- destroys all blocks quickly​

- able to cross gaps with buildings​

- has medium health​

- can place traps to damage everyone (including self)​

Sum up: Builder #2 in HP, #3 in damage dealt and #1 in block removal​

Archer​

- deals (0.5 heart) small damage quickly, repetitively, ranged​

- deals (1-2 hearts) large damage, charged ranged​

- deals 10-15% damage to catapults per arrow, ranged​

- climbs trees​

- has lowest health​

Sum up: Archer #3 in HP, #2 in damage dealt and cannot remove player placed blocks​

Things that could be changed to help out the balance: (I don't suggest all of them at once)​

- reduce the AOE on knights bombs; 6 blocks for insta-death is significant.​

- remove knight ability to destroy player placed blocks with slash​

- make shields only affect the direction it is facing, not 180 degrees​

- give builders and archers 1 heart basic attacks instead of 0.5 hearts​

Quality of life​

- For builders allow a quick switch between blocks either with scroll wheel or number keys (or even some other keybinding) having to hold a key and select or mashing a key to toggle through is too slow.​

- have a priority on tapping once on C to pick up high priority objects (bombs) over low priority objects (dead bodies) so that in the heat of battle a person doesnt have to look at the 5 choices of pick up items to get rid of the bomb at their feet​

</br>--- merged: Feb 4, 2013 5:39 PM ---</br>
One other thing i have noticed is the ability for a knight to hold a bomb and hold his shield and take no damage - if he does this while enemies are standing in front of him they take damage.
The shield should block the damage from hitting people in front of him as it is between the bomb and those in front of him.

 

You do know you can set your own keybindings?

 

still would have to hold a key or tap a key to toggle through the blocks.
There is no "Change so each block type is attached to a key" from all blocks under one key

 

Have you checked the KAG files?

 

So in order to get a quality of life adjustment where i can switch quickly, I am going to have to code it myself?

 

I'm sorry, what?

 

Operating builder blocks is actually hella easy once you learn some basic tricks (tip, look here.
Knights are actually the weakest class as they can't do anything if they are away from the enemy (bombs are expensive and easily dodgable, even with 4 you can find yourself fucked up when facing 2 archers and a builder).
Archers are great in defence because they can start inflicting damage long before knights walking toward them can do it. They are also pretty good in offence if you know how to play.
Builders are kinda weak in offence but they are extremely, extremely powerful in defence. They are essentialy support class and work beatifuly as one but on their own they aren't helpless either. They have also plenty tricks to use.

 

That is, if they actually know how to be builders. :p

 

Personally, i'm sick of the way knights move at the same speed (and faster while slash jumping) as archers, who are supposed to be the mobile class.

 

I am not sure but I thought builders also had 3 hearts. If builder could hit 1 heart damage (he also hit faster than knight, if i know correctly), wouldn't it be the same as knight without slash and he could also destroy blocks. Archers hitting 1 heart with an uncharged arrow would seriously increase arrow spamming. Also knight's can't destroy stone.

So in general: Knight does much damage because it's a close combat and mostly offensive class. Archer's task is to defend mainly and shoot from high ground. (unless you want to be a ninja or Karpovich :) ). Builder is created to be a support class. That means he doesn't do very well on his own in combat. He builds defenses and when in offense can do massive damage to structures when properly defended.

Bombjumping might be a little overpowered. Depends on a server. If bombjumping weren't there, it would increase the need for teamwork. So it's kinda controversial.

 

Don't be fucking retarded, if you did research about knight armour you would know that it was lighter than what modern soliders wear today. It was quite possible to sprint in it. So that ends the realism argument before it starts.

Don't forget archers can climb trees. If archers could outrun knights then playing a knight would be infinitely shit, because you would just get kited all day by archers which need I remind you happens anyway. Game design, learn it before you start complaining. Archers CRUSH knights in anything except for melee range, which is where they will be 90% of the time. There used to be a time where archers could stand toe to toe with knights in melee, it was fun for the archer but anti fun for the knight.

Had you actually played the game you would know that slash jumping slows you down accross horizontal planes but speeds you up accross vertical planes. This is called a trade off and thanks to emergent gameplay gives knights a chance to catch archers and builders as they zoidberg up the side of a tower.

 

Think of it this way. Knight runs into battle and is always on the move up front. Archer is always at the back hardly moving that much. The devs got the texture wrong. Archer are meant to be fat and obnoxious.

 

As well as the needless insults, you have some good points.
However, you may have overlooked the power of bombs.
Archers stand no chance if the knight keeps his bomb until it's about to blow, as a 6 block radius of insta-death is sure to spell doom for them.
If they were just that little bit more agile, they could have a chance against knights. Bombs can be used at medium/large to small range, so obviously knights aren't JUST melee. Also, a knight with reasonable skill can defend against 1-2 archers just by shielding without taking damage. The only thing a single archer can do against a knight is fall on him, fire a quick shot and run. Which, due to the same speed movement, usually ends badly when he reaches some obstacle.