Months without any new items in game.

Fwiw there's a fat update coming for classic probably today which fixes some of the "bullshit" things people have been talking about for a while (with flags to turn most of them back on) - autobalance bias, missing team scramble on new game, archers shooting arrows on death, the SCARY KNIGHT TIMER RESET FLAG (Raron)(which I bet is never used), missing config vars, stomping being unpredictable and missing vars, fixes for lighting (funny that noone noticed it being broken), losing wood while mining gold, the alpha issues with screenshots, able to teamkill by suiciding (probably much to the chagrin of every DELTA member and hopefully to the cheers of everyone else who's been blown up by team bombs), allowed_at_tent var for all classes, collide_when_crouching var in gamemode, and a list of all vars for server owners. A lot of it is to allow more friendly modding, but I cant really allocate more than a few hours to classic dev around scripting.

Re: Will we open up classic to all?

Very likely.

 

It's not 'war mode' it's 'KAG Premium' or whatever you want to call it and yes, that is basically what is happening.

Personally I don't like it at all, because while the new one is fun, it is different somewhat because it is rewritten from the ground up, and there are a few of those things I really wanted in classic KAG which is now basically going to fall out and die. :<

custom hats (since we're not getting anymore at all, Geti won't even add in my favorite new hat ), teams past 3 actually ever working, ever, for doors, or anything at all, and custom zombies that actually work as difficulty appears to be bugged as well as a million other things zombie related. :p

It's really a simple case of a double promise when all comes to it, we were told we'd get some things and many of us shelled out many because of this, but someone else shelled out more with a bigger promise and it's no surprise where the work would go if they believe that those of us who mostly loved classic KAG will also be loving of KAG Premium. It only becomes a problem when the differences are actually shown and only then IF the KAG community prefers to a point where they are vocal KAG classic over KAG premium.

(Of course however it will never reach that point until they've done enough work on it that they can show/give a demo of it)

 

Gofio, act a little less like an asshole? Flipperz asked a serious question, which lots of people answered seriously, including Geti. Do you think that insulting people helps to move topics like this along? Do you actually feel that through calling someone a spoilt kid, in this situation, that you prove anything other than that you are a hypocrite?

Half of the things that you've stated still have problems. Whilst it is indeed a great game, you can't possibly say that it has no bugs whilst taking yourself seriously. I've yet to play a game where there are no bugs, if you have, please direct me to it.

Next time, look at the conversation beforehand, before leaping in with these silly names, because you make me want to cry, especially after people have put actual effort into responses here.

 

Wood only added in because of fire, fire never happening, fire arrows never happening (sucks)
Lanterns a shit without fire because there is no risk of someone shooting it and fire ending up everywhere

I agree totally with zombies being a huge waste, I said it from start to fucking finish, anyone can find my posts but people wanted zombies, zombies never make a good gamemode, they're just a time waster game mode and nothing else, they rarely bring any actual fun, and in KAG I doubt we'll ever see PvE being actually engaging.

But yeah a lot of those things still have problems, bombs even went back to being a bit strange again somehow, no idea how.

Ah here we go again, the "It's only $12" thing, the problem isn't necessarily flat that it's $12 that a lot of people feel they wasted ,that's not it. The problem is that they keep going in directions almost completely counter to the things that people actually fucking care about on the original poster, and now most of them won't be seen in what is KAG classic, when Premium is released why this matters will be much more apparent.

You're right though, KAG Classic's coding is a fucking mess and everywhere and Geti can change code related to fucking ducking and somehow bombs will stop breaking towers because of it, this is due to a lot of things and I can definitely see the reason why they decided to start ground up and work it out the way they did now, lack of commenting and good code practice (not that I'd know any better or even as much in coding so it's hard for me to comment, although I do use comments when I do do things), the problem is that when KAG Premium ends up very different than KAG Classic and what you want is KAG Classic mechanics gamemode you will never see that, you will never have KAG as it is now with fire, or proper 3+ teams working, or any of the other things people wanted. :/

 

It's not that people aren't happy with what we have, that's not it entirely, the problem is that the game had a huge window to actually be something huge and garner loads of attention and stats as well as a large playerbase, if they actually updated smart instead of stuff like 6 months to get zombies smooth (and btw zombies a year later are still not even close to bugfree and anything past just 'playing zombies' you can expect a lot of problems, go ahead and try to add zombies, go underground and see where your zombie spawn above ground disappears quickly if you have custom zombies.

Sure these are things that should be 'bugtested' but it's a grueling process for many reasons, I mean how long did it take before we finally got the ability to actually do a fast 'restart'/reload that works properly from ingame of cfgs so that you could change, test, change, test, change, test.

Anyway, a lot of the stuff even after taking so long still does not work fine, but I'd probably rather have more half-ass stuff in KAG classic than none of it here and all of it in a 'similar but not KAG' game.

 

Do you have any idea how many updates actually ruined KAG?

There were something like 100+ releases that were literally total shit and not worth playing, after 150->240 or so area it started to get BAD for a while, those 250s... oh god, do you remember? Did you even play? Do you know what BAD can come of an update, and sometimes not due to bugs?

Most of the 300s IIRC were also bad and when bombjumping was basically killed, the game was absolute turdshit and I literally stopped playing other than to check if it was finally fixed.

Many people thought we'd get Overworld because when it was announced was before Geti started coding and realizing/sharing with us how the code was literally spaghetti and attempting to add/change ANYTHING was like pulling teeth.

That said, they do do some good stuff, I simply don't point it out because there are so many dickriders (you) who literally just spam "waah but they do so good for us, stop being mad at the devs ^____^" that there is no reason to post more praise.

 

There's only really 2 of us working on the core game :) Tom/Shadlington is basically afk while uni is on, Ryan/FLAB works on API stuff when needed but is part time currently, Dave/SirSalami is PR only, Lucas/Furai is support only.



Honestly the issues with classic are less a lack of "commenting and good code practice" and more a massive accumulation of a little of those things, and a lot of cross dependent code. MM is not a bad programmer, there's code older than 4 years in this engine, and its an absolutely colossal amount of code for someone to have written. I'm not really sure how to explain the magnitude of the classic codebase to people. Programmers will understand "~200,000 lines of code, not counting comments or blank lines", but to the majority of people that's just a big number. Imagine writing a book, having to check that each chapter of the book doesn't make some other part of the book not make sense. At about 36 lines a page (dense 12pt text on A4) the book is over 5,500 pages long.
...And there's a particularly long section about knights and builders and archers that for some reason you decided to write interleaved on the same pages ;) Is it a wonder that things go wrong here and there?
If we had 30 guys as focussed as us and a larger team of dedicated testers (I can count the number of testers that test stuff on my hands, I need 2 hands on a good day), then there'd likely be a damn sight less bugs. But we don't, so we do what we can. (I'm glad that "bombs dont blow up tiles" bug got caught quickly, at least what testers we do have working are thorough :] )

The reality is, the game code can be done in simpler and more maintainable ways than gigantic C++ classes. Scripts that can be reloaded at runtime, and reused by disparate objects. Sprites using different layers to take some of the work off the animator's shoulders. Physics that's actually unified. That's what we've done with the engine overhaul.

The new KAG is quite different from the old one. It's much faster to work with (MM and I added the flowing water you see on the front page of the devlog today, and sorted out the issues with rendering in another half hour or so), but there are also some tricky bugs that need sorting out in it (product of biting off more than we can chew), and a lot of content still to make. We've got a TODO that we're sticking to religiously (refactored today to see if we can make an intermediate/preview release by christmas, no promises cause seriously, there's only 2 of us and a lot of little dot points to check off). We're optimising for the things we've had the most fun with in classic.

It's a shame that classic will flounder in the wake of the impending release and subsequent hard-pushed distribution of the scripting build. We're planning on releasing all of classic for free so that people can see what KAG was like and so you can play with as many of your friends as you like, as a token of our goodwill and to get some of the tangled "if (NET.gold_only || NET.client && !tuesday)" lines, haha.

I felt I should interject with our side of the story. I'll be watching this thread if you want to share your thoughts, its fine if you're disappointed but to be honest, I'm proud of what 2 guys, a compiler, and a shitload of long days have and will continue to pull together.