Rework mines and kegs to better fit their purposes

6 seconds to explode, and you want to to be killing infantry?

 

No, six seconds to arm itself when you toss it down. Once it's live it blows up on contact with any enemy.

Also, this gives me an idea for the replacement of the Mine so that knights don't simply lose an explosive. Knights have bombs, water bombs, and kegs, builders can have mines, so how about we give knights another tossable explosive?

Smoke Bomb
Cost: 50 gold.
Timer: None.
Effect: Creates a 8x8ish tiles cloud of smoke that hides everything inside. The bomb has no timer, instead it explodes when thrown at any surface. It can be used for both offense and defense, as you can use it to hide your exact position when storming an enemy base, or you can hide traps at your base when an enemy assault is coming.

OR

Frag Grenade
Cost: 65 gold.
Timer: None.
Effect: Can be thrown, and the moment it impacts the ground it explodes, dealing heavy damage to infantry but no damage to structures. It can be blocked by a knight's shield, but will still deal 1 or two hearts of damage. Cannot be used for bomb-jumping.



Honestly, this game could use some "detonate-on-impact" bombs, in my opinion, especially if they're only good for infantry battles and they don't hurt buildings.

 

how is the mine strong at all? it costs 4 bombs, can't be dropped from height and gets ohko'd by every class. also every knight can defuse it by pressing RMB

i mean they are cool if used properly but risk/reward is way too much to consider mines a real threat

 

Yeah that's the other thing, they should be unblockable by shields. Also setting them around your base, assuming the changes were implemented, could be a very effective defensive strategy. And how could they not be dropped from heights? You could toss them and they'd stick to anything. In fact, they'd be MORE effective at being toss-armed than before.

 

I think the keg fuse is fine as it is, a patch would just make everyone have to re-learn the timing.

However, I have always thought the actual explosions were a little flat. I think It lacks flair. It's a big barrel of black powder, goddammit. When it explodes, there needs to be the split second of calm before the storm. Then the explosion, which should be a circle shape. The screen should shake a little, and instead of blocks just disappearing, they should be blown away, flying everywhere.

I fully understand that this probably won't happen, but hey, it would be cool.

 

Saws are very visible, don't kill enemies unless they jump on-top of them, and are easily stolen or destroyed.

Currently, public unawareness/incompetence is only part of the problem. As Crabmaster has pointed out, mines can be set off by corpses of opposite color quite easily.

This thread isn't about buffing or nerfing mines, but rather repurposing them to a currently unfilled and more logical role.

 

ummmm, is this logical role a one where they are weak enough that you don get owned by them?

 

This is exactly my point. Mines cost 3/4 as much as much as kegs, yet are as easy to use.

I think this, along with the removal of corpse detonation, would be a good solution. I don't see a problem with removing the mine's offensive potential. We already have the keg as a large assault explosive, and the current strategy of dropping a mine next to the enemy base and hoping it gets stepped on or throwing a corpse on it is counter-intuitive. An organized team, granted, can remove a mine without too much difficulty, but a normal team, not to mention new players, are likely to step on the mine. A larger flesh blast to counteract these nerfs would put the mine in a balanced, useful position IMO.

The proposed role the mine could play has been clearly defined in this thread.

That way mines are more powerful as a defense, and no longer redundantly fill the assault explosive role already filled by the keg.

 

Why would you want to buff defense and nerf offense.
Mines do have a niche that kegs don't. they don't cost as much and aren't as dangerous as kegs.
Why would you make them more "stealth" either? KAG is already very messy, it's hard to spot mines during fight as it is. Making them less visible will only raise the number of random deaths.

Honestly i still can't see the point of this thread. Mines DO work differently than kegs (instead of destroying castles, they allow you to have map control). They are very easy to defuse (hell, if you see someone carrying a mine you can just slash him and kill it. They are also hard to throw upward (if they land in your base it only means you forgot to make a vertical wall) and you cannot really bombjump with them without some inventory shenanigans.
Also as it is, they are threatening to players (they aren't real threats but you know what I mean). Each mine can easily take 2 people (if you place it properly, not in some shitty location like back of your base where nobody goes) and it basically doesn't even require you to be there.
Honestly, I really like current mines as they add some variety but their presence isn't overwhelming or game changing. What is the purpose of making them big and scary so people are discouraged from walking nearby? Do you just hate fun?

 

Yeah I think some of you guys are going to deep into improving mines when there isn't a whole lot to improve. There're perfectly fine and already easy to use.

 

Mines are fine, people whine because they suck at the game. The only ever problem with them was defusing but then someone enlightened me by telling me that they can be disarmed by hitting them.

 

You kindof can disarm them by doing that heres how:
Knight: Shield it so the blast doesn't blow you up
Archer: Shoot it
Builder: Drop something on it? Idk

 

When you drop something on it then it will explode, you need to hit it.

 

Those aren't methods for disarming it, those are methods for safely detonating it, thereby destroying the blocks around it. There's a difference. It still destroys the structure in that way.

 

Why do so many people have sticks up their ass about this?

 

What annoys me is (and I know this is slightly off topic) is when a keg gets destroyed when you are carrying it. Annoys the hell out of me. I just spend a butt load of gold on something that breaks before I can even light the fuse. To me, mines and kegs are already pretty nerfed. Enemy mines you simply just have to jump on with a shield and you go flying up into the air. I really dont ever think I have been killed by a mine, I simply shield jump on it and use the airtime to get over their defenses. And then again kegs just get destroyed easily.

What I think would be nice is higher durability of kegs and 1 heart of damage to people jumping on mines with a shield. Its fair, and makes sense.

 

You shouldn't be able to destroy a keg an ally is carrying. I use slash movement to advance forward and often I inadvertantly catch up to a kegged ally and break the fucker before they light it. THAT is the epitome of annoying.

 

Devs wouldn't want to make things to easy, now would they.

 

As Geti mentioned, mines simply are destructive. Its a fact, it will make a crater when it blows up. Maybe reduce its damage to stone blocks a bit?

However, they're not so much mines as sticky bombs in my opinion. Mines are mostly used to make passing an area very dangerous, much like the spike traps. However, in the game they're huge spiked balls, which resembles the naval mines in WW2 more than anything. If its really a mine, it needs to be smaller and hide in the ground a bit. Also, as a defensive tool, they should cost less, but that's my opinion.

Also, once armed, they should be tricky to disarm. If an archer shooting it makes it go off, why can a knight stab it and break it harmlessly? Makes the investment you made in it mute. I'd say make the builder the only class capable of this, since they're the crafty ones.

As for kegs, I think they're fine as they are for the moment. I honestly like the explosion style, likely an homage to bomberman? They're clearly designed for aggression, while mines are traps, which can be used aggressively, but if some idiot sets it off its they're own fault. Maybe introduce more features in the tutorial, so the newbs don't mess up?

I honestly wasn't even aware of the corpse throwing thing, so kudos if you use this trick effectively. Never used corpses for anything until now.